Lend me your ears

[Normster]

I liked the Heyboer best. It just seemed more balanced to me. Weber was a close second. The Magnetic Components clip seemed a little thinner in the mids, but it also sounded like the guitar player was pretty burned out on playing the same riffs. My least favorite was the MM. It really sounded veiled to me.

I find it interesting that MM calls their OPTs "Tone Clones" when in fact, they always shoot for an "improvement" over OEM. It sounded like they were trying to tame some of the top end hash with their Marshall OPT. I noticed the opposite with their Fender OPTs. I've used MM Vibrolux and Twin iron and didn't care for it in Dumble clones. It seemed liked they extended the frequency range which made the amp difficult to voice. However, when I pulled the iron and dropped it into a Fender circuit, the results were really impressive.

When all is said and done, you could probably voice the amp around any of those OPTs (or maybe just adjust the tone controls). MM's warranty is certainly a consideration if you're an amp builder, but honestly, I don't think Moss has replaced more than two OPTs in the last 5 years using Heyboer exclusively.

IMHO, yes...MM does have a lot of hype, but that doesn't mean it's not a quality OPT.

[M Fowler]

I really liked the MM deeper tone and also the crispness of the MC so both of those transformer clearly won over the other two to my ears .

[Tonegeek]

For that amp the MM would be my choice by a slight margin, although I would prefer a bit more high end. The MM just had more 'girth' - some beefy low mid thing that I associate with a really good Marshall. The MC and Weber were about equal and both seemed well balanced. Surprisingly, I liked the Heyboer clip the least. It sounded a tad fizzy on the top and overall had more distortion than the other clips. It sounded to me like the gain was higher on that one clip. I have an 18 watter with a Heyboer OT and the amp does not sound fizzy at all (unless I give it too much gain).

[sidehatch]

I hate to say this but as a player and not a builder I like the MM the least.

Granted, Its hard to tell over dell speakers but I listened several times and even consulted my wife.

Its not beautiful dumble tone but the MM is muddy to me.The webr is the richest to me.

the MC and heyboer are a tossup but the MM is dead last.

I have a redplate amp here with MM tranny's and I love it so I dont know what that says.

I doubt the others would sound better in the Redplate amp because of the total package.

If MM tranny's make the last few % of tone in your amps then keep on!!!

[angelodp]

Have to say the Heyboer has the most dynamic sound across the spectrum for me.

[heisthl]

If you believe the testing premise the amp settings were not changed, but of course the guitarist may have varied his pick pressure and pick position between takes. I hear qualities in the MM that I don't think any amount of knob twiddling would produce in the others. I do think some knob twiddling would enable the MM to get brighter and thinner so as to sound like the others. It's a shame - I'd really like to find some cheaper transformers but these test clips doesn't change my preference for the MM's. The real fallacy here is the fact that this is a Marshall style amp - if it was a Fender the results would be more likely valid for a D style.

[stelligan]

I liked the Weber least. It seems to me all the others would be a workable solution as a "sum of the parts" solution. MC and Heyboer seemed to have a bit more high end and the MM much warmer and full sounding bass and mids. A more valid comparison would have been a reamped clip of the same guitar performance. These clips, while similar, are not the same. So, a monumental waste of time IMHO. A player will tend to modify his playing based on what he is hearing - letting some things ring longer, pick attack and position, etc..

[mdroberts1243]

I liked the MM the best... it had a full bass sound that was lacking in the HB and Weber transformers and it sounded more 'open' than the MC one.

The MC probably took second place... great at the price! But at certain points I preferred the HB.

I felt the HB was better than the Weber, but both came across as middy and fizzy, perhaps due to the lack of a full bass. The Weber seemed veiled compared to the HB.

I would love to see a comparison like this done with a Dumble style circuit and one, consistent, 'dry' guitar clip as the input to the amp. Perhaps a bit of tone control eq should be applied to get the results close, 'cause I think Heistl is right about certain qualities that can't be dialed in/out between the trannies.

[butwhatif]

one of the things to remember is that too bright a xfmr can be tough to 'un thin' if u know what i mean---there is no eq after it. whereas, it is easy to eq up a bright sound out of a neutral power stage. same goes for mastering song mixes--a thin sound is not as easy to fatten, but a full sound is easy to thin-- if u get the picture

[stelligan]

-a thin sound is not as easy to fatten, but a full sound is easy to thin-- if u get the picture

what he said.... If the frequencies aren't there, they never will be.

[heisthl]

At the risk of contradicting myself - some amps need a whimpy output transformer. Especially if they're under powered, the lack of low bass in the OT makes them more lively and responsive and can add a pleasing character not unlike output tube breakup distortion.

[odourboy]

These clips, while similar, are not the same. So, a monumental waste of time IMHO. A player will tend to modify his playing based on what he is hearing - letting some things ring longer, pick attack and position, etc..

Absolutely! The fact that my preference was drifting from one clip to another during the test suggests to me that there was more going on than just transformer differences. That said, I think overall I liked the MM the best, closely followed by the MC, then the Weber with the HB last. MM was the most open, girthy sounding to me with the HB sounding the most compressed and band limited. OTOH, my son had exactly the opposite preferences, for roughly the same reasons!

I've found the test sufficiently intriguing though that I'd really like to conduct or see the results of one conducted with a D-style amp and using re-amped playing samples.

[bluesfendermanblues]

Why not use Hammond transformers?? isn't that what fender used back in the day on their blackfaced amps

[bluefireamps]

Why not use Hammond transformers?? isn't that what fender used back in the day on their blackfaced amps

The Blackface era was Schumacher. Triad before that. I don't think Fender ever used Hammond. Traynor certainly did, though.
Dave

[Structo]

I agree that the guitar player could have unconsciously altered his playing style while recording these clips.
I would be hard not to.

Maybe a better solution would be to record the guitar in a neutral EQ format then re-amp the recording through the guitar amp with the various output transformers.

That way it would be the same clip but heard through the different OT's.

I don't even know if that is technically feasible.

It would be tempting for Mag Comp engineers to tweak the tone in a favorable manner to sell more trannys.

I still think the MM OT sounded muddy.