more Mids / Mid pot

[Pete]

I'd like to have the ability to get a bit more mids to my amp (Skyline EQ).
I find I'm running the control up very high, even all the way up is not all that much. Just checked the pot (Alpha, not from Mouser), it measures about 209K. I have a few more in the parts drawer from the same vendor all ordered at the same time. Highest one measures 215K. I'm thinking I should try getting a few from Mouser and keep my fingers crossed.

Is this a typical tolerance issue with Alpha pots? I've had this with some other values. Guess I could add a resistor but don't really want to go there.
Would I notice an improvement in range of the Mid control with a pot which measures 250K? I'm thinking yes.
Comments appreciated.
Using:Gib guitars w/HB PUs ... G12-65

[Funkalicousgroove]

Pete,

When you say "More mids" do you mean more actual mid content at the same frequency? You could use a smaller slope resistor (120K, 100K) or an even smaller mid cap (.0068 etc). That would be a larger difference than the pot IMHO, are you sure that it is wired correctly?

You could also go larger on the treble cap-

funk

[greiswig]

I'm with Brandon: the term "midrange" covers a really broad spectrum, that can mean anything from about 200Hz - 2kHz or even more. There's low mids, high mids, etc. "Mids" by itself is usually not real helpful, because it includes everything that isn't bass or treble...most of the sound, in other words.

It's important to understand what part is missing to get the help you're after.

[Pete]

Yes, I think thats how I would say it. I can get plenty highs, usually run Treb at no more then 10-11 o'clock(Bright switch never on). Plenty of low with the Bass pointer straight up. Looking to round it out and fill in the middle a bit more.

Wiring seems correct to me. Only mods I've ever tried in this area is .047 Mid cap, all I recall is I didn't like it (too thin IIRC).
Reduced slope R has crossed my mind, maybe I should try it.

I'm just trying to stick with a base line to determine what is the "authentic" sound and for that, one needs the spec of parts (pots) to be accurate so this is where I wanted to start. Was curious about putting a "tail" to ground resister.
I have bumped up the Treb cap a little (100pf across the 390pf), and it's noticable, just seems like it should not be necessary IMO.
I'll try lower Mid cap just for the experience, thanks.

When you say "More mids" do you mean more actual mid content at the same frequency? You could use a smaller slope resistor (120K, 100K) or an even smaller mid cap (.0068 etc). That would be a larger difference than the pot IMHO, are you sure that it is wired correctly?

You could also go larger on the treble cap-

funk

[Pete]

To be more specific I would say low area above bass, I'm guessing 250HZ - 500HZ. A range usually considered pretty undesirable, like "honky". I might call it fatter, like a jazz box (mellow hollowbody), definitely below 1K. I guess one reason I'm inclined to target the pot was that the tone of the amp with Mid at half is what I imagine it should be at 0. So turning Mid up to 12 o'clock would sound a bit like when Mid on a Fender is near max.
Thanks for the comments.

I'm with Brandon: the term "midrange" covers a really broad spectrum, that can mean anything from about 200Hz - 2kHz or even more. There's low mids, high mids, etc. "Mids" by itself is usually not real helpful, because it includes everything that isn't bass or treble...most of the sound, in other words.

It's important to understand what part is missing to get the help you're after.

[greiswig]

To be more specific I would say low area above bass, I'm guessing 250HZ - 500HZ. A range usually considered pretty undesirable, like "honky". I might call it fatter, like a jazz box (mellow hollowbody), definitely below 1K. I guess one reason I'm inclined to target the pot was that the tone of the amp with Mid at half is what I imagine it should be at 0. So turning Mid up to 12 o'clock would sound a bit like when Mid on a Fender is near max.
Thanks for the comments.

I'm with Brandon: the term "midrange" covers a really broad spectrum, that can mean anything from about 200Hz - 2kHz or even more. There's low mids, high mids, etc. "Mids" by itself is usually not real helpful, because it includes everything that isn't bass or treble...most of the sound, in other words.

It's important to understand what part is missing to get the help you're after.

Do you have the "bass mod" on this amp? (Bass pot wiper tied directly to outer lug) That might be making things worse for you, and it might help to either just make that connection open, or temporarily put a 100k trimmer in there to tweak it to taste, then sub the appropriate resistor in its place.

That low mid range was a problem for me with single coils and the stock Skyliner stack as well. Long as you're trying slope R and such, you could go back to the .05 mid cap and tweak the tone controls some more, and if it still sounds too thin to you try a .02 or .03 there. Keep in mind that I don't think I've ever seen anybody post here that they like their tone controls at 12:00.

Caveat: I'm no expert. If you've got a choice between my advice and Brandon's, go with his. But it also doesn't hurt to try different things, and you learn a lot along the way.

[Pete]

My stack should be like 101 HRM (just checked with the schem, seems to be correct). Working back from Bass wiper (through PAB) goes to top of Bass and bottom of Treb to .1mf (bass cap). Not sure what the "Bass Mod" is though I've seen it mentioned around here recently.
Are you saying the top of the Bass pot should not be connected?
Your comment about single coils is right in line with my concerns. I haven't plugged in with single coils in a long time but was thinking if I did, I would be lacking the fullness I want even on neck P.U. Would like to find that turning up the Mid level would fill it in.
Have not tried anything yet, just thinking this through, thanks again.

Do you have the "bass mod" on this amp? (Bass pot wiper tied directly to outer lug) That might be making things worse for you, and it might help to either just make that connection open, or temporarily put a 100k trimmer in there to tweak it to taste, then sub the appropriate resistor in its place.

That low mid range was a problem for me with single coils and the stock Skyliner stack as well. Long as you're trying slope R and such, you could go back to the .05 mid cap and tweak the tone controls some more, and if it still sounds too thin to you try a .02 or .03 there. Keep in mind that I don't think I've ever seen anybody post here that they like their tone controls at 12:00.

Caveat: I'm no expert. If you've got a choice between my advice and Brandon's, go with his. But it also doesn't hurt to try different things, and you learn a lot along the way.

[ayan]

To be more specific I would say low area above bass, I'm guessing 250HZ - 500HZ. A range usually considered pretty undesirable, like "honky". I might call it fatter, like a jazz box (mellow hollowbody), definitely below 1K. I guess one reason I'm inclined to target the pot was that the tone of the amp with Mid at half is what I imagine it should be at 0. So turning Mid up to 12 o'clock would sound a bit like when Mid on a Fender is near max.
Thanks for the comments.

It's impossible to give you "good" advice without knowing the whole ciruit, but I have some ideas. I think you'rer rerferring to the real honk range, which is centerred around 750 Hz IMHO. A Skyliner EQ, with the knobs pointed straight up, will NOT emphasize that. The sound will be a bit scooped in the mids, and the low end and low mids will dominate.

Try replacing the mid cap with a .05uF and the mid pot with a 100K linear pot. THAT sound will certainly be a heck of a lot honkierr with the knobs pointed straight up. If the treble is too much, as it may be already, you can always use a 250K audio pot, which is what DUmble put in the older amps. Leave the bass pot at 500K audio, but if you want to try something differnt go to a 250K with a 1K tail resistor to ground. If you make all these mods, you will end up with a Classic EQ, which to me makes the perfect (dumble style) amp for a Strat.

Gil

[Fischerman]

IME if you want more low mids then adjusting the mid cap is the easiest way...smaller value gives more low mids.

If you wanted more high-mids then increasing the treble cap would be my suggestion.

If you wanted 'more of everything below the high-mids' then I would suggest decreasing the slope resistor.

The slope resistor mod will increase the bass along with the mids/low mids where the Mid cap mod will tend to just focus on the low-mids.

[Pete]

Thanks very much guys. Lots of good suggestions and helpful comments. I will play around to see what I can learn, unfortunately no time in the near future.

I will add that I think it's a fairly subtle change I'm interested in, and I'm very pleased with my builds (1 each, 50w & 100w) overall.
As for the full blown change to "Classic EQ", my limited experience leads me to believe it would be extreme for my taste. Though I may like to move somewhat in that direction tonally (always interested in exploring), I'm not sure I would like a complete change (from Skyline). As I said, I don't normally play single coils much.