Trainwreck Chassis via Funkalicousgroove??

[dr. who]

Funkalicousgroove wrote:
I WILL be offering the wreck chassis, in superior quality of course.

This sounds like something I will be trying to get my hand on....finally something up to Ken's standards. I believe that Ken's looking down on Funk something like this

[GrungeMan]

That was real professional!

Grungy

[drhulsey]

....finally something up to Ken's standards.

If you will remember, Ken's chassis were so "flimsy" he used pieces of thick dowel to keep them from collapsing under the weight of the transformers That had nothing to do with the magnificence of the tone he could evoke from his circuit, but his chassis weren't built like tanks. I could stand on the Express and Liverpool chassis I have gotten from Allynmey
I haven't used any Ceriatone products, but they seem to have held up reasonably well in an A/B comparison to a real wreck. I'll be happy if my Express clone does that well

[mhuss]

Bad form IMO to explicitly diss a competitor, even in private correspondence.

Also bad form to quote private correspondence in a public forum.

My 0.02

--mark

[dr. who]

This started in another part of the AG in the overtone special post(link provided below). I just thought that some of the people in the Wreck side of this place would like to know that there will be chassis up to the quality of the chassis that funk provided for the ODS copies...thats why I made the comment about ken and how he would be proud as his weren't always up to par, and he didn't like that, but the manufacturers were slack so what was he going to do, loose all that money or use what he had- he used what he had. Sorry that y'all thought that this was a flame war...

https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.php?t=3582

[mhuss]

Thanks for the clarification.

I reduce my original rant to "Bad form IMO to explicitly diss a competitor," even if it seems warranted.



--mark

[Richie]

Its kind of like we are missing some of the info,as to what is going on.
No matter what you think of Niks stuff.. how can anyone diss an amp they haven't heard?

[Tubetwang]

i agree with Mark.

I know Leo would'nt diss the competition..

He even gave credit to the Croatian for the Strat's headstock.

I've seen too many poor Indians in the 70's sleeping naked on the sidewalks. China was no better.

Call it Eastern revenge' with a big powerchord.

Folks vote with their wallets. When buying-is-the-mood, they want the more-for-less.

Guess who will provide?

In my neck-of-the-wood folks were buying Chevy's in the early 60'.

Honda and Nissan arrived in the early 70's and changed the equation.

Detroit got pumped big time. By their own fault. Japs had better products for less money.

Times are changing. The East is where the West was 80 years ago...slavery and cheap labor abounds but better economics and education will prevail.

The west is losing it slowly going the way the Romans did, tipping the scale, sick and overweight.

The East is coming on top slowly but surely, ungry and fit, willing and able.

See the light,adapt or die.

As an avid hobyist, i've ordered many chassis from Nik. Tweed Deluxe, Bassman, Wreck etc..

I've always had great service, fast reply and good products delivered in a timely manner. Same with Hoffman, Angela, Triode and others.

Flame me.

[CaseyJones]

Times are changing. The East is where the West was 80 years ago...slavery and cheap labor abounds but better economics and education will prevail.

Oh, good. That means there's a happy ending.

The west is losing it slowly going the way the Romans did, tipping the scale, sick and overweight.

Wait! NOT so good! I thought better economics and education would prevail? Guess you weren't talking about us.

The East is coming on top slowly but surely, (h)ungry and fit, willing and able.

My mental picture has an Asian chick on top and that's o.k. by me but that's probably not what you meant. I'll say this... I still believe in the American dream. That's the one where work pays dividends and there's a future we can all count on.

[dr. who]

I'll refrain from getting too involved in how the real stuff in a Wreck makes it special and thats why a komet isn't one and thats why the kits that are put together with lesser quality components for cheaper prices are just like that- a cheap ill sounding copy of a wreck. Thats why Ken and HAD didn't like theives stealing their designs, because they take only their schematics and forget to account for the way these things sound because of all of the miniscule differences that the components make. That being said, these kits when heard in person by someone who has heard real TW, sound like knock off production line amps...no better than a new vox, fender, or mesa. I have only heard a limited few that start to have the sound coming closer to the real wreck sound, and all of those were using non-kit sent parts.

[Tubetwang]

Although not perfect, every one believe's in the American Dream.

I meant to say that folks in the East want a part of it (Capitalism).

Can you blame them?

Who wants to stay poor??

My wife's is a College teacher. Who stays after school till midnight? ... and comes to campus to work and study on weekends? Indians and Chinese.
Can't compete with that, my friend.
Were spoiled!
Hey, i'm just as lazy as the next guy...

My all time model is Leo Fender.

He built the best products at the best price!!!
That IS the American Deam. They were boutique priced back then and they sold.

If Nik's wreck or liver is not to duders liking at 7 bills...nothing stops them to do what Ken did...tweak tha mother till the cows come home. Unless you can come up with a 600$ kit that sounds better, they will buy Nik's kit...

I'm reading Tom Wheeler's excellent "The Stratocaster Chronicles" and "the Soul of Tone"...Beautiful books...graphics and pictures are top notch (i was a magazine photographer for 25 years). I have loads of books.
These two rule!!!

They were printed in Chine.

[Paul86]

This is exactly the kind of stench that drove me away from TGP. Whenever one hears criticism it's always a good idea to see who's criticizing. Perhaps these guys do feel pissed that there are quality/safety issues with products coming from Malaysia "under the radar", and perhaps they do so from a technical standpoint. Perhaps they also have a moral right to slag anyone who they suspect profits from slave labor. Great. The US gave "free speech" a whole new meaning - one I think is great, by the way.
Now, what about the fact that there's someone who's selling a VIABLE product at a VIABLE price for those who don't have money coming out of their a#$#$es. What about the fact that there's someone who's selling a product for those of us who don't necessarily have the technical chops to put a great amp together but want to have a go anyway?
Let's face it, if the economy really operated on moral grounds there would be no poverty left in the world. People buy with the money they have, or else they go into debt.[/b]

[nickt]

I'm sure Funks chassis will be fantastic like the rest of his stuff.

[drhulsey]

... It'll be interesting what happens when labour is no longer where savings can be made on production...

What a thought provoking idea

[LeftyStrat]

I'll refrain from getting too involved in how the real stuff in a Wreck makes it special and thats why a komet isn't one and thats why the kits that are put together with lesser quality components for cheaper prices are just like that- a cheap ill sounding copy of a wreck.

Well, if you're going to "refrain" then perhaps you shouldn't be posting on a board dedicated to helping others achieve successful wreck or dumble builds, regardless of whether they sourced their own parts or purchased them from a specific vendor. And secondly, the parts in a Komet are vastly better quality than those used in any original TW. Ken designed the Komet, I'm sure he would be pretty pissed at your statement that a Komet isn't a Trainwreck.

Thats why Ken and HAD didn't like theives stealing their designs, because they take only their schematics and forget to account for the way these things sound because of all of the miniscule differences that the components make.

Bullshit. I'm pretty sure the desire to not have people steal their designs had more to do with making money than "Oh, it's okay if the vendor selling a clone kit gets it right."

That being said, these kits when heard in person by someone who has heard real TW, sound like knock off production line amps...no better than a new vox, fender, or mesa. I have only heard a limited few that start to have the sound coming closer to the real wreck sound, and all of those were using non-kit sent parts.

Wow. So the secret is "non-kit" sent parts. Forgive me for calling double bullshit on this statement. You aren't the only person to have heard or played a real trainwreck, and I have heard plenty of clone clips on this board to know they sound better than any new "vox, fender, or mesa."

Back in the late seventies I bought a Paia Modular synth kit and spent a summer assembling it. It was cheap, with some cheesy cost cutting designs, flimsy front panels, faux tolex over fiberboard for the case, and probably everyone would agree it didn't sound as good as a Moog or a Buchla or an Arp. But you know what? I made some pretty interesting sounds with it, learned a lot from building it, and had I waited until I could afford a "professional" synth, I might have never got a chance to explore the world of synthesizers. And I also wouldn't have forged an interest that led me to spend thousands later in my life on ultimate quality synth kits (look up Synthesis Technology MOTM).

If a Ferrari was the only car available, many of us would be walking. A VW bug will still get you to work, though it probably isn't as fun to drive.

For many people who are building their first amps, they need to test the waters with a minimum investment, before they can be sure amp building is for them. Starting cheap and then upgrading components is a great way for the novice amp builder to learn what pieces really matter. Perhaps having the perfect kit would in fact lessen the learning experience.

Hinting that this vendor or that vendor's kits won't produce a "real" wreck might sway newbies reading this board. But for those of us that have successfully built incredible sounding wrecks, it comes off as more than a little pompous. This board is dedicated to building great sounding Dumbles and Wrecks AND helping others to do so, and to suggest that someone can only achieve that with one particular vendor is asinine.

There is room in any market for both high-end and low-end, and room for multiple vendors. Your post suggesting otherwise stinks with the same putrid aroma as the poison that destroyed 18watt.

I don't believe Omar ever intended this board to become a place for people to promote or dis another vendor.

Tell you what. You build a TW from the "select" components using your vendor of choice. I'll build one using a two by four as the chassis with cheapest chinese sockets I can find screwed to the two by four. I'll use the only full set of caps I have on hand (Wima). I won't use a turret board and the standard layout, instead I'll use terminal strips and true point to point. I'll use carbon comp, metal film or carbon film, you choose. I'll use lamp cord or whatever wire you want me to use, and I will shield the whole thing with the cheapest aluminum foil I can find.

Then we'll both post clips and let people vote on which one they like best. We'll send the clips to Omar to post so no one will know which clip is which.

If you are here to learn or help others learn, then I apologize in advance for mistaking your intentions. Any other reason for being here is leeching off of this community.