Any bicycle riders here?

[Phil_S]

I'm an accountant. As you might imagine, I spend a fair amount of time in Excel. I was an early adopter of the electronic spreadsheet from the days of Visicalc, so I've had a bit of time to explore the medium. At best I consider myself an intermediate level user. I've seen people marvel at what I can do, but I know it is fairly pedestrian. There's so much feature-wise, it is hard to master the content without a practical application. What you did there required having a very clear vision of the project. While I'm suppose there is room for a critique and there is always room for improvement, it is a marvelous invention. Congratulations and thank you for your contribution.

[ER]

That's a really cool program Martin! I used to build custom and production frames and stems for people and do a lot of fitting back in the late 80's-early 90's, that would have come in handy. I've been wanting to do the same thing with motorcycles, I always thought it was weird how custom motorcycles hardly ever take the rider and intended riding style into account.

[martin manning]

Thanks Phil and ER. In this case the computer really is "a bicycle for the mind" as someone famously said.

Phil, if you want to try the fit calculator part out, get measurements of yourself per the instructions and I'll be glad to help you get them loaded. It's a very simple fix to get a representation of a flat bar in, too. The best tool to use to help with body measurements is a framing square, if you have one. PM me if you want some help.

[Zippy]

Yeah, I know you were asking about trying a Champ as your first build, but with just a few more parts you could have a Dumble SSS. Look what I made.

I'm thinking about buying a hybrid. I'd like to be able to trail ride...light off road and on road, not real "mountain." I have an old road bike I don't use. (I mean old, like 30+ years old and in need of serious reconditioning to the point where it doesn't pay.) I'm looking for advice. Anyone here know something about this? Thanks.

Did the Phil's question ever get answered?

[Phil_S]

Oh yes, I got plenty to think about. Very pleased with the replies, thank you.

Martin, I might just take you up on the offer. I might wade through your 40 page manual first. I think you can understand, someone like me likes to know how the widget works.

Phil

[Phil_S]

I'm getting close to making a choice. We'll see what happens. I bypassed the scientific aspects of fit in favor of simply shopping and seeing what size the store people picked for me. I went to several stores. I think they all chose the same size for me, though what that size is called varies by brand. Let's say, mostly it's a medium.

Working this through with the store people and friends who ride, I have come to agree with the assertion that most bikes at similar price points are similar in quality and components. Priorities seem to stack up this way:
1) Fit. If is doesn't fit right, forget everything else.
2) Store. Bikes need service. Go with a store that has a good reputation.
3) Differences among the various brands.

I found I like the fit of the Specialized Crosstrail and the Trek DS best. I rode a few other brands that I either didn't like or just felt "ehh" about fit and feel.

Comparing the Crosstrail Disc to the DS 8.3, the price spread is $10, or really nothing.

Component-wise, Trek wins with a better quality rear derailler (Shimano Acera over Altus), but not by very much. I can't see much difference otherwise.

Frame material...impossible to tell, but Trek's marketing material seems to imply they use 3 grades of which this bike uses the middle grade. Specialized explicitly states the tubing is double butted, but with their bottom grade material (which is probably excellent stuff to begin with.)

I found two shops that are probably going to be equally as good on service. The Trek dealer is 3 minutes from my house vs. the Specialized at 15 minutes away. Trek wins on convenience. As a bonus, it turns out the owner of the Trek shop rides with two of my friends...didn't realize this until I saw both of them last night and talked all of this through.

Near conclusion: On 1 and 3, there is little difference. That brings it down to who I'm going to buy it from. On that basis, the Trek seems to win. I'll see if I can screw up my courage and pull the trigger. It's a big commitment.

[matt h]

(deleted)

[Phil_S]

I went over there this afternoon. The "kid" at the counter (who remembered giving me the demo last week) ordered one for me. Since it is something they ordinarily stock, he said I can pay for it when I pick it up later this week. That's the kind of business you don't often encounter these days. I took it as a good sign. The owner was there today and I introduced myself and had a nice chat with him.

[Zippy]

<applause>

Nicely done!

[Structo]

My neighbor is into it.

About a year ago he was riding and a van turned in front of him.
He bounced off the windshield and over the van.

Van was full of illegals, most of which fled the scene.

Long story short he healed up and got a new road bike.

I don't know brands but the frame is carbon fiber, wheels are carbon fiber.

All I know is I could pick the whole thing up with one finger......

$$$$

[Phil_S]

Yeah, I didn't go that high end, carbon fiber is $$$$. You could buy a car for what some carbon fiber bikes go for. I didn't get a road bike. I ordered a hybrid. Maybe I missed this, but my impression is that carbon fiber isn't the best material for off road. All that abuse tends to make it fatigue prematurely. It differs from a road bike: flat handle bar, 700x38 tires (typical roadie is 700x23 or 700x25), different geometry. What I did get is DISC BRAKES! These are supposed to be able to stop on a dime. I got the mechanical type. They may hydraulic, but I figure a) something to break that I can't service and b) too expensive for my taste.

Thanks for the applause. I hope it will be available for pick-up on Wednesday or Thursday!

[Zippy]

Maybe I missed this, but my impression is that carbon fiber isn't the best material for off road. All that abuse tends to make it fatigue prematurely.

I tested some carbon fiber layups for Boeing a couple decades ago. I was impressed. You usually start with fatigue loads at about 95% of tensile failure. This stuff wouldn't die in a reasonable time at that load. I had to set the peak load to 98% for it to expire in low cycle fatigue. Then I found some samples that died within a few hundred cycles - turned out that the machinist was trying to do me a favor to make the E-glass tabs on the ends adhere better, so he scratched the material before laying up the epoxy laminates.

Bottom line: Carbon fiber composite is very notch sensitive. Scratch it up with a mild crash in the rocks, and you're done.

It sounds like you had the opportunity to make some good choices. Enjoy your new bike.

P.S. Please invest in a helmet. Don't be a crash test dummy. You'll leak all over the road.