Liverpool-bound with a few questions

[pryde]

Hello all. New to the forums here and gearing up to build myself a TW Liverpool. It seams like a good route is to go with an RJ Guitars kit to get close to the "real deal" yes?

The only issue I have is the wattage/power of these beasts. It looks like RJ has a 15 watt LP version (2 EL84 with smaller xformer) as well as a 35 watt (4 EL84). I really just want a 15-watter providing it sounds like a LP still. So initial options are:

a) 15 watt LP
b) 35 watt LP and pull 2 tubes
c) 35 watt LP and add a VVR

What wound be the best end result? Open to all thoughts and suggestions.
Thank you.

[Blackburn]

You can build it just like Ginger, the first TW (Liverpool) made, which had a half power switch. Not hard to implement if you plan on building it like a regular Pool, with split cathode resistors/capacitors for each pair. The switch grounds one pair or doesn't. The OT primary impedance is 6.6K and is kind of in the middle, between a quad (4K) and a pair (8K), so it works for both.

[Colossal]

Personally, I would go for the 4xEL84 version. There is very little difference in cost and part count between a 2xEL84 and 4xEL84 version. Both amps will be very loud. But four tubes is more harmonically and tonally complex and will move the low end. You can manage volume with a post phase inverter master, an attenuator, and a VVR. Or a combination thereof. You can pull two tubes out of a 30W amp to get lower output, but you can't put more tubes into a 15W amp.

RJ is a great option and a nice guy.

[pryde]

You can build it just like Ginger, the first TW (Liverpool) made, which had a half power switch. Not hard to implement if you plan on building it like a regular Pool, with split cathode resistors/capacitors for each pair. The switch grounds one pair or doesn't. The OT primary impedance is 6.6K and is kind of in the middle, between a quad (4K) and a pair (8K), so it works for both.

Thanks I will look into that option. So then would you say a half-power switch on a standard would be better sound-wise than a straight 15w or is it just a matter of being more versatile?

[pryde]

Personally, I would go for the 4xEL84 version. There is very little difference in cost and part count between a 2xEL84 and 4xEL84 version. Both amps will be very loud. But four tubes is more harmonically and tonally complex and will move the low end. You can manage volume with a post phase inverter master, an attenuator, and a VVR. Or a combination thereof. You can pull two tubes out of a 30W amp to get lower output, but you can't put more tubes into a 15W amp.

RJ is a great option and a nice guy.

Good points for sure. Also I suppose if I didn't bond with it a ~30w amp might be easier to sell as well but I hope that is not the case.

[Blackburn]

You can build it just like Ginger, the first TW (Liverpool) made, which had a half power switch. Not hard to implement if you plan on building it like a regular Pool, with split cathode resistors/capacitors for each pair. The switch grounds one pair or doesn't. The OT primary impedance is 6.6K and is kind of in the middle, between a quad (4K) and a pair (8K), so it works for both.

Thanks I will look into that option. So then would you say a half-power switch on a standard would be better sound-wise than a straight 15w or is it just a matter of being more versatile?

There's something about a quad of EL84s that impacts the girth of the tone. It would be nice to have that option. I'd consider an attenuator like Colossal says, rather than any internal modifications.

[pryde]

Hmm leaning toward a standard LP and doing some attenuation begs a new question:

Should an Express should be on the radar as well?

I play pretty equal amounts of strat and les paul so really would like the amp to play nice with both. Also prefer more midrange than less which I remember reading the LP has a bit more mids than the XP. Thoughts?

[Blackburn]

The LP can be really bright and everyone says it's something special with single coils. I'd say an Express will give you more of what you're looking for if you play both types of guitars. I assume you've checked out Glen's clips? This one in particular where he plays a Strat and LP...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfX5cmSMPyo

[Bob S]

The Liverpool & Express share very, very similar pre-amps.
It comes down to the power section.
Personally I like a 4x el84 Liverpool with single coils.
Sounds a little fuller with around 30w as opposed to 15 to me.
Whichever way you go - good luck.

[pryde]

The LP can be really bright and everyone says it's something special with single coils. I'd say an Express will give you more of what you're looking for if you play both types of guitars. I assume you've checked out Glen's clips? This one in particular where he plays a Strat and LP...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfX5cmSMPyo

Thanks. I did check out the vid before. Both guitars sound fantastic but I have seen some clips where strats and les pauls sound great on a liverpool amp as well with a strat sounding even better so still on the fence.

Anyone know if rj guitars is doing business? I emailed last week but have not heard back. Maybe because of holiday weekend?

[Blackburn]

RJ is still around. He's pretty busy, so give him time. You can also PM him here.