5E3 vs 5D3 as bass amp

[EtherealWidow]

I'm looking to do a Tweed Deluxe build next, but will need to use it as a bass amp for an album I'm doing. I'll be making some small modifications to the circuit and using an SS rectifier. In your guys' general experience though, which would be better suited for a bass amp? I know some general things about both amps, and I realize that most of you have experience with the 5E3 and that the 5D3 is kind of a sleeper, but I'm hoping some of you guys have valuable info. Thanks!

[wyatt]

I couldn't think of a less suitable bass amp than either.

Zero preamp headroom.

Weak filtering.

Cathodyne PI.

Small OT.

I would think you would have to remove the cathode-bypass caps throughout the preamp, massively upgrade the filtering (which you can do with the SS rectifier), completely redesign the PI, maybe isolate the channels and add negative feedback. At that point, it's a completely new amp.

This is a "can't have your cake and eat it too" moment ,IMHO.

[Milkmansound]

The deluxe has very little bottom end and no midrange dip which is crucial for bass.

If you build a non reverb Princeton, and keep it at low volume you will get a really nice bass sound even if you leave all of the values stock.

[xtian]

I recently completed a 20-watt SE build for a bass player. It is essentially an AX84 SEL with a KT88 and a fender TMB tone stack. I added a post-OT line out, and he runs that into a 600-watt class D power amp when he needs serious volume. It sounds great!

So, low-wattage amps can be cool for bass, if you plan to add a line-out for recording or reamplification.

[EtherealWidow]

Thanks for the replies, guys. I'm definitely not looking for anything to gig with and distortion is no problem, actually quite welcome since it's a metal studio project. I had heard of a couple people who really liked using their tweeds for bass, even a 5F1, I guess those people aren't on this forum. Maybe a stripped down blackface is in order though for the scoop and the NFB.

[rock_mumbles]

Just last Saturday I played a bass through my brother's modified 6K6 5E3 amp. I think it has smaller coupling caps than stock (0.022uf throughout) ... I know it has a large cathodyne grid stopper (470k)

The instrument channel is a stock 5E3 input channel, the microphone channel is a 5F2 (not 5F2A) input channel ... the single tone control is a dual ganged pot, with a separate tone control for each channel ... the preamp still has the 'weird 5E3' volume control interactivity.

The 5E3 channel was completely useless for bass guitar ... a stock VJr is a much better bass amp ... I would expect a 5F1 or 5F2 or 5F2A to be better also.

The 5F2 channel (with the weird tone control) worked pretty well up to a point, especially with the unused 5E3 volume up near full volume ... I would expect a blackface Princeton with the lows tightened up, large OT, and huge cathodyne grid stopper to be even better.

My vote:
Modified Princeton Yes!
5E3 or 5D3 No!

The 5E3 distortion with a bass isn't a usable distortion it's horrible

[rp]

I guess any amp can be a bass amp if you play it low enough but the 5E3 won't even allow that as volume ramps up so damn quick. If you insist on Deluxes for some odd reason I would look at the 5G9 (w/o the trem or just off) as it's fixed bias and has a bigger, and bigger sounding, cab, IIRC the last ones had the Brown Deluxe OT which would also be a better option, or even better w/ the BF 6.6K one, and maybe best w/ Allen's over-built offering.

Better 4U IMO: If you want something low powered with that bouncy sound but also very alive and immediate go for an early octal tweed bass amp like the 5B6. Lots of old posts on it here. Others might chip in on its worth as modern bass amp, but played low with the right speaker (a 15") I bet it would sound really sweet. The plates should be around 380V which means no problem using a ss rectifier thingy too. You could mod it w/ a cathode / fixed bias switch too, but played within it's boundaries I bet it would be soft and bouncy, in a nice way, w/ the cathode bias alone. If you want a safer bet and a little more jam then the 5D6 might be fun, drop the dual 5Y3s re-spec the PT and use a 5AR4. The 5D6 is a well respected blues guitar & harp amp, if it fails at bass I bet you could find a good home for it.

[EtherealWidow]

Alright. Thanks for the suggestions. I'm tied now between the 5B6 and the modded 6A14. The 5B6 looks really cool, but I think I'm leaning toward the 6A14 stripped down and cathode biased. Xtian, what kind of music does the guy with the SEL play? That's a lot of distortion. I'm almost done with a Hi Octane for someone else. It's a neat little amp.

[old tube]

I recently built a 5C5 circuit and it is very nice for clean Bass up to about 10 watts output. Remarkably deep and rounded sound and that's through a Reissue Jensen P15N in an open back cab. Using old coke bottle 6L6's in the output running them slightly cool with the cathode bias at 270 ohms rather than 250, otherwise stock circuit.

[rp]

I recently built a 5C5 circuit and it is very nice for clean Bass up to about 10 watts output. Remarkably deep and rounded sound and that's through a Reissue Jensen P15N in an open back cab. Using old coke bottle 6L6's in the output running them slightly cool with the cathode bias at 270 ohms rather than 250, otherwise stock circuit.

I built a 5C8 Twin pretty much to show off a mint pair of coke bottles but to tell the truth 5881s and 6L6GB sound better, more 3D. I tried an other pair of 6L6Gs too, same thing. If you have some old USA 5881 try them out, especially for bass, I think.

[EtherealWidow]

Nice. Like I said, it seems some people quite like their tweeds for bass, others, not so much. I think eventually I'll get around to building a modded 6A14 for use with both guitar and bass.