Possible 4x12 incarnations

[Structo]

Is that the 2 x 12 3/4 back cab?

Or the closed back 2 x 12 vertical cab?

[selloutrr]

here is a mesa on ebay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... 0391246240

[Mill Creek Audio]

Looks like the 4X12 has a sealed box on the bottom, my comments pertain to the 2X12 only.

[Mill Creek Audio]

Here is a shot of the 2X12. Although they offered it with an EVM in the bottom I never measured to see if it was a thiele box.
Of all the things I've tried on a rig to improve it the two things that made a noticable difference were good AC power filtering and vibration isolation. I made that tray and used a set of sorbathane pads rated for the load, about $20. Details/part # available.

[Structo]

Nice!

So that 2 x 12 has ports on both sides of the bottom speaker?
How do you like your Kleinulator?

Have you ever tried a Dumbleator to hear any differences?

What power conditioning do you run?

Sorry for all the questions but you opened the door.

[dano-rator]

MCA,
I'm always down to build and try a cab I haven't before - if you wouldn't mind measuring the pertinent dinensions I love to have a go at it.

Thanks a bunch,
Dan

[boldaslove6789]

That vertical boogie cab is quite interesting, I need to check one of those out.

[selloutrr]

2x12 on craigslist

http://southbend.en.craigslist.org/msg/1572898858.html

[Structo]

The thing that always turned me off about those Mesa cabs was the industrial grill covering.

I know it's probably more transparent than a grill cloth but I have yet to see one where the speakers weren't faded out to a dull grey color.

I have yet to play through a TL 806 Thiele cab, I will probably have to build one before I run across one for sale.
Where I live it seems all you ever see on Craigslist is the student crap that the kid never used or the Peavey solid state practice amps.

My town has around 250K+ people and there is like two music stores.
The larger one sells only Peavey amps and PA.
I asked the salesman why they only carried that and he replied the market here won't support the higher end stuff.
I'll bet Hartley Peavey would like that comment.......

[Mill Creek Audio]

-So that 2 x 12 has ports on both sides of the bottom speaker?

Yes

-How do you like your Kleinulator?
-Have you ever tried a Dumbleator to hear any differences?

I owned a Dumble-ator in the early 80's when there was an interest in Dumble amps and I built a few amps for pals, Dumble-ator kinda fell into my lap from another deal...
The Klein-ulator works well, had to put it on the scope to see which stages were getting too much signal. Now I run it with amp first vol at 5 along with the master and keep the two top knobs on the Klein about 2 O'clock and use the bottom knob as my master. It's not the real thing but I'm getting killer tones with it. Been waiting for Nik's -alator, no time to build any now!

-What power conditioning do you run?

I found a good cheap one on ebay, was about $60 w/free shipping - has a real EMI/RFI filter in it. Better than I've seen in some....

Sorry for all the questions but you opened the door.

No problem!

[ER]

I used to play through two boogie 4x12 "half-backs" with all celestions, I ended up running them with all the back panels removed (yes the 4-12 was sealed on the bottom half), and eventually went back to the theile EVM 1-12. I prefered the EVM in my combos too (1-12 and 2-12), and eventually some custom 4-10 EVM cabinets with fender style back panels that sounded the best of all.

The only closed back cabinet that I ever liked was my 4-12 hiwatt with well broken-in fanes. Never heard a marshall cab that I fell in love with I had an old straight front loaded with wolverines that was useable,I'd love to try an old 8-10" cabinet though.

It's tough to beat the TL-806 or a pair of them, an oversize 1x or 2x cab with the oval or fender style back is nice too. The nice thing is that all these also make the best DIY projects.

All of what I described is in regards to an all-rounder, clean AND overdrive, Blues, Rock and Funk in a live band setting with a real drummer all based on my personal tastes. If you were going to focus solely on one type of sound, things may change some but for all around working speakers these will do.

[vibratoking]

I've owned a Mesa 4x12 cab since 1984? Been a long time since I purchased it along with one of the first Mark IIIs. It has 2 Celestions in the fully open top and 2 EV Black Shadows in the fully closed bottom. It is a decent sounding cabinet at normal volumes. And it does take alot of power to get it wound up, but it sounds great when you do. My biggest complaint is that it is beamy even with the top and bottom chambers open. It'll take your head off if you are in the line of fire. It can provide alot of thump, but overall it's too much for most of the gigs I do these days. I still enjoy taking it out with my Fuchs ODS50 on festival size stages. It will put a smile on my face and it adds a specific sheen to clean sounds. This might be the EVs? Anyway, my experience says that the open/closed concept isn't really that beneficial.

The metal grill is hokey and really doesn't fully serve it's purpose of protecting the speaker. Too many objects can easily fit through the openings. It seems to invite children to poke whatever is in their hand through the openings. I also had a problem with buzzing of the Mesa/Boogie advert plate. I just removed it as I don't really like advertising anyway.

[Structo]

Have you tried the Amplifier Directivity Modifier using the foam in front of your speakers?

Quite a few guys like this method more than a beam blocker type diffuser.

You simply make 3" holes in the foam at the center of each speaker and put it behind the grill making sure it doesn't touch the cone.

It apparently makes the volume and tone about the same no matter where you stand and the audience isn't slayed by the ice pick highs on the beam.

Attached is a PDF file showing how to do it.
The type and weight of foam is the critical part of doing it.

This foam here is apparently the best stuff to use.

http://www.thefoamfactory.com/packaging ... arCharcoal

[Mill Creek Audio]

The foam with a hole in it may work for some but I found it kind of silly. Did not do what's claimed for me. Since the highs come out of the center more than the rest of the cone, I found it worked the opposite! I had a high freq laser beam shooting out of that hole. I tried to buy the beam blockers I have for a pal and they are no longer available so I got him some adhesive backed soft domes that stick to the inside of the grill cloth, we'll see how those work. I'm very happy with mine.
Seems the 2X12 Boogie I mentioned and own is very different than the 4X12, see if you can plug your amp into one!

[Structo]

Interesting because the guy that developed this said the highs come from all parts of the speaker cone, just that when your ears are in line or on the beam of the speaker you hear more highs than off axis.

I realize it won't work for everybody, heck I haven't even tried it but it all made perfectly good sense to me the way he described it.

I found on the huge TGP thread that the ones that said it didn't work for them did not buy the correct foam, did not have the proper thickness or density of foam or made some other change that was not recommended.

It remains very subjective and not everybody hears the same thing.

I found after reading the first thread about it in it's entirety, that the large majority of people that tried it like it very well for live performances.
Because they said their guitar sounded the same no matter where they stood on stage because of the way the foam diffuses the sound.

If the highs do indeed come from the center of the speaker then you could simply put a cross of duct tape over the center of the speaker on the back of the grill cloth.