5f11 dropping B+ voltage

[Mike52]

I think everybody here knows their way around a fixed-bias amp. That is probably why it just didn't occur to anyone that you would be trying to measure the idle voltage without resetting the idle operating point ;^)

Huh, ok. Let me take a run at it:

Q. Well if the zeners aren't zenning, what's your current cathode to ground?
A. Cathode to what?

Q. Pin 8, across the 1 ohm resistor. Nevermind. What was your current to begin with?
A. I dunno, was I supposed to write that down.

Q. Do you know fixd bias amps?
A. Not really.

Q. Ok, to use zeners to drop B+ voltage in a fixed bias amps your gonna need to ...

(......and scene.)

How'd I do?

[pompeiisneaks]

I don't think there was an attempt at a bickering match, I think Sluckey stated what you said was the fix in a way that maybe wasn't completely clear, but communication is never a perfect thing. Your earlier response seemed to be a "since nobody here helped me, this place stinks, I got my answer elsewhere". That's not what you 'said' but the context implied it to me at any rate. I guess it just seemed pretty negative when you'd been given good help and information that you didn't really respond to, and then implied it wasn't helpful.

Not trying to offend, just thought it was really odd that you got the help you needed, even if you didn't understand what was being said OR if Sluckey could have worded it better, but you took the time to talk in a negative light about the responses here. This forum isn't known for being a big 'fender, vox, marshall' forum, but people still do help the best they can. Sluckey is one of the most generous helpful people I've seen on any forum, and I frequent both this and el34world.com and have been part of many forums over my days. This forums primary focus is more on the dumble and trainwreck stuff. This means often you get less people reading and responding to these threads.

I gotta say, the level of support here was pretty underwhelming. I would have thought more people were familiar with a fixed bias circuit. But that's ok, no one is obligated to help anyone.

seems a bit inconsiderate IMO.


This could all just be a misunderstanding, but basically, my thoughts are that you could have been a little less negative about it.

Edit: typos

~Phil

[Mike52]

I agree that it came across negative and really kinda ungrateful for the input I did receive. I think it was just a personality clash with me and the thread in general. I have to say that I've haunted forums like this long enough to collect some pet peeves, and I think a few of the boxes were checked along the way. If I want to expand my knowledge by trying to apply zeners to drop B+, you can imagine how I'll receive lazy advice like "Why not throw it away and buy a new tranny." Or just radio silence. Not the end of the world, just the way threads go sometimes. And I'm sure none of it was intentional. Some threads are breakthroughs, others just end up not going anywhere. I should be thankful for the home runs and shrug off the misses.

I agree that Sluckey serms very generous with his knowledge here and at Hoffmans forum. If he was suggesting a solution, I obviously didn't have the depth of knowledge to tease it out as I indicated above. I dont think this place stinks, I think it was just a communication thing. These forums have their own dialect, and I really haven't been around long enough, or been messing with amps long enough to speak it with the precision needed to get the best answers. Ultimately, the community would have been better served if I had said nothing and just shrugged it off.

[pompeiisneaks]

Yeah I get that, and I too agree sometimes here there's silence on a topic. I think the readers far outweigh the commenters, but there are still some super knowledgeable people here that do help when they've got the time.

~Phil

[joeboo88]

also if someone is helping you, we might not want to chime in and muddy the waters and maybe add confusion, if you are getting sound advice

[Mike52]

also if someone is helping you, we might not want to chime in and muddy the waters and maybe add confusion, if you are getting sound advice

Not sure I'm following. Muddy the waters? Like suggest scrapping the plan and going with some other approach or component?

[M Fowler]

Reading this kind of crap thread is exactly what I mean when I say this Forum has literally gone down the shitter.

I rarely read the threads because the posters don't try to solve their own issues or learn about tube amps on their own.

Asking questions is fine we all need help at some point but really it's getting ridiculous.

Lazy comments, really?

Mark

[Mike52]

I rarely read the threads because the posters don't try to solve their own issues or learn about tube amps on their own.

LOL, awesome. Thank you for this.


Also, if you are that grumpy old guy who lived over on Calhoun St when I was growing up, I want my baseballs back.

[joeboo88]

also if someone is helping you, we might not want to chime in and muddy the waters and maybe add confusion, if you are getting sound advice

Not sure I'm following. Muddy the waters? Like suggest scrapping the plan and going with some other approach or component?

No what i meant was, if someone is helping you ( sluckey) and you are getting good advice from him, there is no reason for someone to chime in and muddy the waters of the thread
saying something like " i had and amp...blah blah and i think someone fixed it doing blah blah" then the next thing that happens is your help thread is going off on a tangent, like this thread is doing now , because of your comment about the level of support here was pretty underwhelming. it would be like me coming to your house and saying "wow what a dump, you should redo your living room"
In the end you made a booboo with your comment, we all make booboo's but we can move on. Lets do that. okay enough ranting... happy happy

Mark, if you read this don't feel too down, we appreciate all the help that does happen here and you and your blue boards

[pompeiisneaks]

Reading this kind of crap thread is exactly what I mean when I say this Forum has literally gone down the shitter.

I rarely read the threads because the posters don't try to solve their own issues or learn about tube amps on their own.

Asking questions is fine we all need help at some point but really it's getting ridiculous.

Lazy comments, really?

Mark

I find that odd, because on every forum I've ever been on, there have been plenty of people that ask you to do everything for them, and get upset if you don't solve their problems for them. I'm not sure how this forum would magically escape that commonality.

I'm not specifically saying the OP is in this case, just making the point that this is common everywhere I've been.

I've been on forums that focused on firmware for canon cameras, where you have to be a coder to debug assembly language stuff etc. I volunteered to help but don't know the deep assembly language level stuff, (but I am a software engineer) but the experts didn't deem me worth their while because I couldn't do 99% of the work and only need 1% help.

I've been on brewers forums where I was already really good at it, self taught, and I dug helping people with new questions that had no clue, even if they seemed to be 'being lazy'. If you don't like helping those people, don't, I don't understand the need to denigrate them though.

Or is the purpose of this forum to just stroke the egos of the brilliant minds? I myself am still a very new builder and amp guy, and get things wrong it seems more than I get them right, but love building them and keep trying no matter what.

Is this supposed to be some kind of secret space where we don't want people joining and we need it to be an invite only forum? Seems weird to me, I prefer sharing knowledge and learning from others myself.

My 2c

~Phil

[pompeiisneaks]

also if someone is helping you, we might not want to chime in and muddy the waters and maybe add confusion, if you are getting sound advice

Not sure I'm following. Muddy the waters? Like suggest scrapping the plan and going with some other approach or component?

No what i meant was, if someone is helping you ( sluckey) and you are getting good advice from him, there is no reason for someone to chime in and muddy the waters of the thread
saying something like " i had and amp...blah blah and i think someone fixed it doing blah blah" then the next thing that happens is your help thread is going off on a tangent, like this thread is doing now , because of your comment about the level of support here was pretty underwhelming. it would be like me coming to your house and saying "wow what a dump, you should redo your living room"
In the end you made a booboo with your comment, we all make booboo's but we can move on. Lets do that. okay enough ranting... happy happy

Mark, if you read this don't feel too down, we appreciate all the help that does happen here and you and your blue boards

specifically " there is no reason for someone to chime in and muddy the waters of the thread"

that didn't happen at all in this thread, not sure HOW you got that. Did you read the thread?

Mike52 asks question, several attempt to help with info, then:

Sluckey and Mike52 spoke back and forth with no one else interjecting it was 100% sluckey and OP only.

Then the OP had a few comments of questions about sluckey's info, and then finally said "oh i fixed it".

Who interjected making it confusing and muddied the waters?

Or are you referring to the 'the thread is now done and we're discussing things about OP's response"?

Seems really unnecessary to me.

Or am I completely misunderstanding something?

~Phil

[M Fowler]

Or is the purpose of this forum to just stroke the egos of the brilliant minds?

My 2c

~Phil

You have no idea how right you are with that statement. You should have been here when we went through that stroking and prodding.

Mark

[joeboo88]

Sorry Phil: maybe i need language lessons...lol
What I originally meant was if Steve is helping and he knows alot, and is helping Mike out, we see Mike is getting good advice, we dont need to add our 2c
Because Steve has it under control.
That's what i did anyways, I followed along the course of this thread and I learned too. I felt i didn't need to add anything (muddy the waters) as Steve was doing his usual great help.
Maybe some guys read and felt the same as I do, dont know.....
I hope this make sense..... I have no ego, as I come here to read and learn, and maybe give my 2c when its applicable...
Peace

[Mike52]

I've been on forums that focused on firmware for canon cameras, where you have to be a coder to debug assembly language stuff etc. I volunteered to help but don't know the deep assembly language level stuff, (but I am a software engineer) but the experts didn't deem me worth their while because I couldn't do 99% of the work and only need 1% help.

I've been on brewers forums where I was already really good at it, self taught, and I dug helping people with new questions that had no clue, even if they seemed to be 'being lazy'. If you don't like helping those people, don't, I don't understand the need to denigrate them though.

Or is the purpose of this forum to just stroke the egos of the brilliant minds?

Is this supposed to be some kind of secret space where we don't want people joining and we need it to be an invite only forum? Seems weird to me, I prefer sharing knowledge and learning from others myself.

My 2c

~Phil

The topic of this thread was essentially using zeners to drop B+ in a Vibrolux clone. What I discovered through my questioning and subsequent work and reading was that the real topic was actually reducing B+ in a fixed-bias amp using zeners and how that differs from a cathode biased amp. Building and modding amps is a hobby for probably a lot of folks who lurk here. And our knowledge base can vary by a great deal depending on the level of experience we have, and that's just the way it is in hobby forums. And what we interpret as "lazy builders who want others to solve their problems" may just be newbies who are so inexperienced and stymied, that they don't even know what questions to ask in the first place.

I think I struck a nerve here based on the responses, and actually I'm glad I did. I belong to another forum and I'm pretty active there. Active enough that I feel a sense of ownership of it and I'm protective of it. The way that manifests itself is that I try to be helpful, ascertain the level of knowledge that the OP is working from, and if I have input that's where my input begins. I try to meet them on their level. And I'm pretty tough on my fellow active members who do denigrate those with less knowledge, or use the space in a way that doesn't promote sharing knowledge. I'm sure all forums have those problems. And I think its a healthy discussion to have. Maybe it's more useful to dedicate its own thread to it. But it's good to have the discussion and remind people that everyone starts somewhere.

If my forum ever becomes an exclusive club where we go to stroke our own egos, or regale our peers about the time in 1978 when Howard Dumble banged his shopping cart into our brand new truck in the Piggly Wiggly, than my forum dies. Thanks for your input Phil, and your efforts to make this thread something positive. And thanks again to Sluckey for suffering a fool for a bit.

We live in a free market. And growing the ranks of DIY amp builders will result in greater variety and more choices in the stuff we buy. That's how the fools like me have a downstream benefit to you.

[M Fowler]

So you came over to this forum to stir up some shit is what I got out of your ramblings.

Chances are a lot of us most likely belong to this other forum your so proud of.

Mark