Commercial interest, DIY, opensource, etc

[jelle]

I have the impression his is based on another amp which is based on sn whatever...that turquoise one.

Also, I wish people would use their real names and if in the biz, their company name in their sig. I would like to mention Andy Fuchs as a great example here.

[vibratoking]

passfan posted a beautifully photographed set of pics detailing everything in Nik's SSS some time ago.

[LeftyStrat]

passfan posted a beautifully photographed set of pics detailing everything in Nik's SSS some time ago.

I missed that. Thanks, I'll have to go find it.

[M Fowler]

passfan posted a beautifully photographed set of pics detailing everything in Nik's SSS some time ago.

I missed that. Thanks, I'll have to go find it.

https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... &start=105

[LeftyStrat]

passfan posted a beautifully photographed set of pics detailing everything in Nik's SSS some time ago.

I missed that. Thanks, I'll have to go find it.

https://tubeamparchive.com/viewtopic.ph ... &start=105

Thanks Mark. I must be losing it, I even posted in that thread.

[briane]

I always say:

if you want to share it, put it out there.

If you want to keep it for yourself, lock it in a box, and show noone.

Funny how many people seem to get the 2 confused - or want both.

I personally share most, but still keep a few bits and pieces to myself.

[Leo_Gnardo]

As a simple and innocuous move, would it be useful to require those with commercial interests in guitar amplifiers to provide the name of their companies (however big or small) in a signature?

Sounds fair 'nuff to me. Audio Asylum requires commercial users to NOT use their company name as moniker, also requires a statement of professional/commercial involvement - or not - as a part of the sign-up. Those who are found to be pro's/comm's without revealing it are shown the door. The door OUT to be specific. Doesn't happen too often. Now seriously, if somebody wants on, they're going to get there without too much trouble. For the sake of transparency TAG might consider a similar rule. This does bring up a question though, where do you draw the line? If you have a company that builds say a hundred or more amps a year, that's commercial all right. I repair lots of amps, but occasionally once a year or so build one for a customer. Does that count as "commercial involvement or interest?"

[matt h]

Leo, I'd say that techs who work on amps also have a commercial investment even if they never build a single one. I'm sort of envisioning this not as a rule fit for banning, but as a community-wide nod to transparency, honesty, and integrity. I've held back a bit on what I think would be good and why to give room for others, but I guess this is as good a time as any.

There are so many people here in the business. Asking/Encouraging (not necessarily requiring) users to be forthright about business connections--I can't see that'd actually change the day-to-day dealings one bit. Why do it then? Well, as I said, it's a step toward a community (which is to say a network of individuals) who not only share an interest in guitar amps, but a dedication to transparency, honesty, and integrity. I can't see how this would be a bad thing for anyone. For some posters, it might give their posts necessary context that prevents friction. In other cases, it'd give context to why there IS friction. There's been some nasty stuff popping up in several of the subforums and this isn't just about the recent lock/delete/deacto stuff in the Technical forum.

I'd say most of the users on this forum are painfully aware that being in business doesn't necessarily make you an expert. (to clarify, this is a hypothetical "you", not you personally). There are plenty of knowledgeable users here with different experiences--amp techs, amp builders, amp designers, engineers, hobbyists, students, etc. However, those with monetary investment have different reasons for exhibiting certain types of behavior... making some things more or less likely.

The only users I can envision this hurting are those who are essentially frauds or simply incapable of civil behavior. It might mean, for those in business who act poorly or show a dangerous lack of knowledge, that their business may suffer a hit to the reputation when potential customers might find out that the guy they just paid a hundred dollars for a 3-prong conversion doesn't know what's going on. This also would reflect poorly, maybe not to customers, but to other builders, for those specific commercial cloners who steal other people's circuits, boast about knowledge of the circuit and the possession of a schematic, and refuse to share information. It's certainly their choice not share, but wouldn't it change how other people view them if the big picture was revealed?

I wouldn't say this needs to be a mandatory "rule!", merely a... strongly advised and widely-accepted invitation. It's absolutely true that people could create fake or anonymous accounts to get around it. I'm less concerned with the few "bad" apples, and more concerned with longterm viability of the good ones.

I can see a number of positives coming from this-- it may mean that, for instance, a lot of the small builders around here may find a broader network for repairs/diagnostics for customers in other parts of the country. I've seen threads that essentially are calls for this exact thing, so I know the interest and benefit is there. It may also prompt more individual mentoring between users of different experience backgrounds. An advanced engineer who's never built a guitar amp, and a seasoned paint-by-numbers builder, or repair tech who doesn't know theory, just the "how" might strike up a specific kind of dialogue that could be beneficial to both parties.

One other thing I might suggest is a subforum specifically for "drive-by" questions. It seems a number (not huge, but consistent) of users log on, post one (maybe two) threads, and then vanish. I'm separating this from trolls... but the "help me identify this thing that my grandfather left me in his will!" sorta thing. I'm sure there are enough people here who are helpful enough to continue responding to those sorts of things, but again, being a bit more honest about the post (and the likelihood of becoming a member of the community) may actually keep some of the resentment and frustration in check.

[LeftyStrat]

I have no problem with any pro or semi-pro amp tech coming here for help. I probably couldn't help him as much as some of you more experienced guys. Those answers add to the tome of knowledge that TAG has become. I google all kinds of questions and TAG is the top hit, with either a short thread to fix problems, or a longer thread to gain insight into circuit design.

I only have a problem with those that profit from the information here, but never give a single thing back to this community. Even a simple "thanks, I'm going to offer a kit of this," would be enough to change my attitude to the Nik's of the world.

"Thanks for sharing the circuit, I'm going to Nik this design."

A simple sharing of one single schematic by Nik would go a long way to mending my opinion of Ceriatone.

I don't worry about it too much, Karma's not just a bitch, she's a dominatrix. She'll rape you like you rape others.

Nik has to realize he will never be able to release an amp that isn't documented here. The pro amp builders who have contributed on this forum have never had one of their designs exposed here, as far as I know.

[martin manning]

Lots of good thoughts there, Matt.

I agree that knowing who is who from a commercial interest perspective wouldn't hurt a thing. If you hang out here a while you figure it out, but a user name or sig line containing that info, or including it in the user's profile would help avoid misunderstandings when commercial builders or manufacturers are protecting their IP. As you say, it can't really be enforced, and there will always be reasons, some noble and some not, for some people wanting to remain anonymous.

I don't mind the drive-by's too much. Seeing and discussing gear, as well as lending a hand to get it working, is educational and rewarding. Where it gets less enjoyable for me is when someone with little interest in the technology or history of a thing beyond its market value is just looking for some free services.

Seems like there is just a slightly different set of rules and code of conduct that are appropriate for commercial entities as opposed to DIY'ers and hobbyists. Most people that show up here understand that difference and some do not, but to Lefty's point that should not preclude mutually beneficial and educational exchanges between those groups.

[Leo_Gnardo]

"Thanks for sharing the circuit, I'm going to Nik this design."

Good one Lefty!

And - with matt h & Martin - lots of good thoughts.

Makes me curious who's lurking behind anonymity. I know we have some hi quality manufacturers whe ARE known, and I'm very happy to have them on board, for instance Jim Kelley, John Suhr, Bruce Egnater. But who's behind the Groucho mask?

[RWood]

It is an absolute certainty that no one on this forum has ever built an amp for self or profit without using knowledge gained from others.


Thanks to all the TAG members for helping me without putting conditions on it.

[Teleguy61]

I don't think we need any new rules I just think we should be vigilant and uncourage the drive bys to stick around.
I

I'm with c on this one.
One of the beauties of this forum is that it's pretty much self-policing.
A**holes are called out and shunned, sincere folks tend to hang around and be encouraged.
Letting nature take its course has generally worked out here.