Multi-amp setups

[vibratoking]

I have tried multi-amp setups in the past and have never really found one that is acceptable and worth using for live gigging.

Eric Johnson uses three separate amps/processing. One for clean, dirt, and lead, but never uses them together AFAIK.

Joe Bonamassa uses 4 amps. He uses a Marshall Silver Jubilee that is ALWAYS on and switches other amps/processing in conjunction with the Jubilee.

I have tried both methods, but never really found one that I could gig with. The EJ method works great but it was never good enough to motivate me to carry all that gear to the shows that I do.

JBs method yields some nice sounds for certain songs. But the amp that is always on can sound wonderful or terrible depending on the song. The problem is that the 'always on' amp is too clean in a situation where I want sustained or crunch sounds, for example. Or it is too dirty in a situation where I want a really clean sound. So, I guess the problem boils down to mixing clean and dirty amp sounds together.

Anybody have any ideas, thoughts, recommendations to make amp mixing work well?

[daydreamer]

Hi Mate,
I used to use 2 mid 80's roland cubes in a stereo set up. One was 100 watt the other 60. I would set the larger one to a more bass heavy sound and the small one to treble.

Because I was in a funk outfit at the time, I was the defacto 'keyboard player' i.e I was using alot of rotary speaker effects, phasing, basically stuff that sounds better with a wide stereo field.

I've read of guitarists that run two amps in stereo, one always clean and on all the time, the other clean with effects and over drive as needed. The theory being, the listener will perceive that the whole sound is effected when actually only one amp is overdriven, etc. They do it this way to increase the clarity while thickening the sound, among other reasons I can't remember.

the marshall quad boxes can run stereo if you had another amp head to run through it, still it's not a solution for making it easier to lug around. I'm a big fan of running in stereo, the slight phasing or whatever creates that 'album' sound I think.

[M Fowler]

They're using their effect pedals more then what is being told to get their signature sounds.

I don't get to play JB or EJ type concerts, but instead play variety music for bar crowds

So I run two amps into a stereo 4x12 with English Celestion Vin. 30 speakers. One amp is of the TW Rocket or Stangray four EL84 variety for clean or grit and the second amp will be of two EL34 variety for heavier lead rock.

I tried not using my pedal board but I think I will go back to using them for my benefit. Just plain easier to get what I want. I have a switcher that I can run A or B or together.

Use a home made linear booster, Boss Blues driver (gain) pedal, Boss distortion pedal and Boss metal pedal which covers everything I need to play. I also have Zen Overdrive which works very well also.

Probably doesn't help you but thought I would throw it out there anyway as I don't believe you can get what you want with out a pedal.

Read the interviews it starts off oh I run a stripped down rig just me, the guitar and my amp, oh and this pedal and that pedal and sometimes throw this pedal in there but mostly just straight to the amp. Yeah right!

Mark

[selloutrr]

the trick to mixing amps together happily is volume. if you use a constant "on" amp and switch in other amps. put the "on" amp on a volume pedal or build a footswitch with a set amount of attenuation so when you switch you can keep the volume levels constant and not clutter the other amps tone you are bringing in while still keeping the clean amp running so you have definition in the notes played.

I use this trick in the studio all the time but I use automation and SPL meters.

Panning is also a big effect, Running the inside clean and the outer amps in stereo for all effects.

I agree it's a hastle to gig with, if you aren't touring with roadies use a couple modeling amp modules and save your back. Plug them into the PA system and call it a night.

[Buschman]

An 18watt Marshall with a 5e3 deluxe sounds real nice. A multi amp setup for different tones is for the guys that can hear the difference in batteries in their Tube Screamer and have underpaid rodies to haul their sht......

[Reeltarded]

It's been working for me for 30 years with anything I use.

The MIX is in my MONITOR.

[Gibsonman63]

I have played with multiple amp setups for years and I keep getting back to one amp with two speaker cabinets. It seems to me that with multiple amps there is just as much subtraction as addition going on when you try to combine different type amps at the same time. With two different types of speaker cabinets, I think you get the same effect with less cancellation. I have friends that refuse to play mono. The ones that sound best to my ears are the setups with two identical amplifiers.

In my experience, a multiple amp setup through stereo effects sounds great to the person playing but in a club situation, really doesn't have the same effect in the PA mix. To accomplish that, you would have to mic each amp, run the PA in stereo, pan each amp to a different side and listen from the sweet spot in between the main speakers to really hear the effect. When you consider that the main purpose of your PA in a small to medium club situation is sound reinforcement and always keeping the vocals clear and on top, that can be a tall order. If it gets a better performance out of the player, then it is still worthwhile.

One last comment. A lot of guitar players don't think about the band mix as a whole when they build thier rigs and work on getting thier "sound". I hear a lot of guys with the scooped sound with tons of bottom on the guitar. Alone it sounds really full and powerful. Add a bass guitar and a drummer with a strong right foot and all that bottom gets lost in the mix leaving just a tinny high end sound becuase there were no mids to begin with.

Recording is another story because there are many ways to find space in the mix with EQ'ing and panning.

[vibratoking]

It's been working for me for 30 years with anything I use.

Having them all on at the same time or switching between them?

It is easy to make it work while switching between them, but not so easy when using them simultaneously, IMO. Using them together requires amps that handle input changes, pedals or guitar volume changes for instance, in a way that is always musically pleasing. There is a trick to getting that right and I have not found it as yet and I have tried more than 20 different amps. It is hard to combine them musically for a wide range of tones from clean to dirty.

I am just wondering if anyone has done this successfully and would care to discuss or share findings.

[JamesHealey]

I used a Cornford Hurricane and Deluxe Reverb Reissue and switched between them for gigs for quite some time.

I'm actually considering the multi amp setup again, but lugging all that gear around is a total ball ache!

[stompjunkie]

for a long time I used my old marshall 50w half stack for dirty, and a twin reverb for cleans. I also built a looper that would turn on both and add a custom distortion pedal for the twin that I could use for solos. It was a sweet setup, but my back didn't like it one bit.... not to mention the nerves of taking that much expensive equipment to bars.

[boldaslove6789]

I've been using a multi amp rig for a few years now. The best yeild I've yet to have is when each amp has there own designated pedals . For instance:

100w HRM amp w/ D-lator & a TC verb in loop & 2x12 cab with EvM12's

With a 40w 64' bandmaster (with skyliner tonestack and a pre amp boost) w/ a tone Tubby Hempcone. This amp breaks up and has a very pronounced Midrange which breaks up just enough to blend with the Clean or OD of the Dumble clone.

Or I use A dimed 50w plexi style amp and a 2x12 cab with g1265's and a fuzz face with the HRM's Overdrive channel.

The key to multi amp setups is Volume and blending frequencies. You don't want to blend Mids with Mids or Trebly sounds with trebly sounds.

You have to blend in what the main amp is missing. When I use the 50w plexi with the OD channel of the Dumble clone it adds Bass and more volume for a Mid boost.

[Gibsonman63]

I've been using a multi amp rig for a few years now. The best yeild I've yet to have is when each amp has there own designated pedals .

You're definitely on to something there. To me, matching the right distortion pedal to the amp is critical to getting the right lead tone. I use a TS-9 type pedal with my Marshalls, but the Fenders need a bit more gain to keep up, so I use a DS-1 or and SD-1.

I suppose you could build a looper to activate two parallel signal chains simultaneously from one footswitch.

[boldaslove6789]

I suppose you could build a looper to activate two parallel signal chains simultaneously from one footswitch.

Yup, thats what I use. When I hit the OD on my amp I can either use the plexi in or out of the chain. Usually I use it to cut through the mix.

[ER]

One of my favorite sounds for a power trio was when I would run into a digital delay with the dry out going to a stereo chorus that would feed a pair of dean markley tube combos that would switch to overdrive together, the delayed signal I would set for a very short delay time with no repeats to a hiwatt custom 50 half stack in the middle set relatively clean with some good bottom end to it. I would tweak the delay time till everything blended into a huge wall of sound, when the two stereo amps were switched to overdrive the hiwatt would keep this great definition presence and gitrth that blended really nicely.

Kind of a wet dry wet set up with a few miliseconds of delay to get the frequencies to blend seamlessly so it sounded like one huge amp.

-E

[Structo]

I used to mess around with a stereo rig.
Although I never gigged with it I can see where it would sound cool, depending on the style of music being played.

I don't think a lot of guitarists think a lot about their tone beforehand then make the mistake of the scooped mids and heavy bass and treble.

It sounds counterintuitive but the mids are what cut through the mix the best.

It may not even sound that great by itself but when combined with the other instruments it can sound really good.

So it's good when a guitarist, be it a rhythm player or lead player has a critical ear and makes the proper adjustments when in the band setting to make the guitars sound the best possible.

I think in the 70's and even 80's there was one tone............LOUD!

I can remember going to concerts and just getting blasted by multiple stacks of Marshalls (think Ramones) and not being able to distinguish notes.

I think somebody said of the Ramones that, they only play for an hour because nobody can take another minute at that volume!

Rock on!