Truly a new 12AX7???

[Lonely Raven]

I've never heard of these, and stumbled onto them today.

Anyone have any info on these:

http://cgi.ebay.com/The-Event-of-the-Ye ... dZViewItem

[Tubetwang]

Thanks for pointing this tube Lonely.

It is news to me...but from my old audio days...i remember Mr. Liu as a well respected man in the Hi-Fi tube world, with Jolinda etc.

He can be trusted!

TT

[billyz]

Someone over at the Vintage Amps Bulletin Board Forum tried one.

"Well, 25 days after I ordered it, it finally showed up today. It came in an envelope with a 1/4" of padding on each side......not packed well at all.

I opened the box and it's a nice looking tube. Nice gold pins. I put it on the VTV and the first triode tested good with a gain of 95, and it was quiet. The second triode was weak at 65 and it had a noisy hum. GREAT! Laughing Laughing

OK, I told you guys I was an idiot to try this....and I proved my idiocy once again. Well, at least it wasn't microphonic. Smile

So, I need to contact the seller and get it replaced or get a refund. $70 for a clunker isn't too good....but it's Ebay so I shouldn't be too surprised. Very Happy I'll almost certainly have to pay to ship it back to get a refund or another one.

Aren't you guys glad I volunteered for this and not you? Razz I'll try the tube in an amp for the heck of it later and see if I can get an idea of what kind of character it has. One triode is strong, so I should hear something....hopefully the hum isn't as loud in the amp I try.

I'll keep you posted what the seller says. He definitely doesn't know I'm doing a review, look at what I got."

http://vintageamps.com/plexiboard/viewt ... c&start=15

[Structo]

Sounds interesting but at that price it better have matching triodes and be perfect, that is, if it is indeed a new high end tube and not simply a re-labeled tube.

They say in the ad that: Each tube is individually packed as on the photo n°3

[img:400:353]http://i7.ebayimg.com/03/i/000/f7/2a/4989_1.JPG[/img]

The fact that it was shipped from France in only a padded envelope is enough to turn me off from trying one.

[Phil_S]

Couple of thoughts in no particular order....

Shipping cost for one tube should be closer to $5; I don't care where it's coming from. Right away, this is a sign of a rip-off to me.

$50 is too much to pay for a tube on eBay from what amounts to an unknown dealer. At that price, personal service and reasonable recourse are required, in the event of a problem....like the one described above.

Telefunken is generally a brand that audiophools chase. In the guitar world, it's Mullards that we want. Not that there's anything wrong with Tele's -- I've got a pair of EL84's that sound considerably better than just about any other tube, and I've got one 6AQ5 that I've got in a Champ-thing, that sounds terrific. But I diverge. We want a Mullard 12AX7 for V1. Besides, those audiophools seam to have an unlimited supply of cash. Call 'em glass sniffers. Sorry to be so cynical on this point.

Groove Tubes failed miserably, IMO, with their attempt to replicate the Mullard 12AX7. Why should we expect different from this example. Again, call me cynical, but there is a good chance these were manufactured in the very same factory.

Gold pins is more audiophool stuff. Gold pins will improve the tone of these tubes when pigs fly. This is yet one more caution flag.

Matched triodes are not important for guitar amps. More audiophool nonsense. Besides that, just how many do you think the seller is willing to reject before he lowers his standard of what's considered a match?

Just another 2 cents on this topic.

[Andy Le Blanc]

50$....... 14$ to ship........ forget about it.......
looks like some found a shipping container lost in costums.....
and you bought it.....

[strato17]

Groove Tubes failed miserably, IMO, with their attempt to replicate the Mullard 12AX7. Why should we expect different from this example. Again, call me cynical, but there is a good chance these were manufactured in the very same factory.

Matched triodes are not important for guitar amps. More audiophool nonsense. Besides that, just how many do you think the seller is willing to reject before he lowers his standard of what's considered a match?

I completely agree with you that this tube sounds like a scam, I do feel differently on a few points, though...

I have 2 original Blackburn code Mullards as well as 4 of the Groove Tubes 12AX7M's. Two of the 12AX7M's dont work at all(typical of a chinese tube), BUT the other two that work sound MARVELOUS! I can hear almost no difference between my two Mullards and the two 12AX7M's. But considering that only 2 out of the 4 I own dont work, I am assuming that quality control and consistency is a huge issue, and this is why they can't stock them anymore.

As far as matched triodes, I have always been told that this is very important for the phase invertor.... since each triode affects one-half of the signal. But thats just what I've been told. Myles Rose from Groove Tubes has told me that in most amps that take a 12AX7 PI tube, any balanced decent quality long plate 12AX7 will work fine.

[Phil_S]

2 of 4 is a comment on consistency. If a tube dealer has to cull this many from a batch, it probably isn't worth carrying the tube. <Rhetorical Question: Who sells tubes that are 50% defective?> I'm not buying or the tube dealer has to jack up the price unreasonably. All of a sudden, even the used, but not used up genuine GB made Mullards look very attractive.

BTW, I hear the Reflector-made Mullard 12AX7 is actually a really good tube at around $16+/-, and so is the Reflector-made Tung Sol.

AFA matched sections for the PI? I suppose it is appropriate if they are not too different. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing. There are people besides me who know a great deal more about this than I do.

[jimipage]

fifty bucks? made in China? F that!!!
('nuff said)

[strato17]

2 of 4 is a comment on consistency. If a tube dealer has to cull this many from a batch, it probably isn't worth carrying the tube. <Rhetorical Question: Who sells tubes that are 50% defective?> I'm not buying or the tube dealer has to jack up the price unreasonably. All of a sudden, even the used, but not used up genuine GB made Mullards look very attractive.

I do agree. The consistency was terrible, BUT if you find a good one, they IMHO are the best sounding current production(err... recent production) tubes out there.... at least for the Mullard type sound.

I have bought many groove tubes products, and I have only had problems with the 12AX7M. I have a set of the GT EL34M XF2's in my express and they sound excellent!

However, Fender has recently aquired Groove Tubes. So any problems with quality control is about to increase exponetially.

[CaseyJones]

Great new tubes? Time for Santa and the Tooth Fairy to make a comeback.

Hope springs eternal, we all hope that someone will plunk down the dough for nice new tooling to make nice new tubes. It makes me wonder what happened to the Phillips tooling that was kickin' around in Japan?

Some Mullard tooling ended up in India. Where is it now?

Problem is new tooling costs money. Big money! Then the machines have to be set up and run by people who give a shit, I'm not holdin' my breath waitin' for that to hapopen.

[Structo]

Fender bought GT?
Man, what don't they own?

[Ears]

fifty bucks? made in China? F that!!!
('nuff said)

My guess is that comments such as above will only do their little bit to make China even more determined to drive USA inc. out of business.

[Andy Le Blanc]

Fender deosn't own Best Buy......yet......

[CaseyJones]

fifty bucks? made in China? F that!!!
('nuff said)

My guess is that comments such as above will only do their little bit to make China even more determined to drive USA inc. out of business.

I doubt it.

The Chinese have correctly assessed the Western appetite for cheap disposable goods, they stepped forwards to manufacture cheap disposable goods. "Chinese quality" is like Chinese democracy, it's lip service to a concept that's apparently alien to their culture. While we're at it we should examine Western concepts that simply don't translate or transplant to other cultures like democracy for instance. In a true democracy the people frequently elect ineffective leaders. Erm...

We could look to Japan for a model of an emerging industrial nation. Roll the clock back 30 years, look at where Japanese quality was. Look at it now. If China pulls that trick off we have something to worry about.

Then look at China's last minute attempt to clean up Beijing for the Olympics. That puts an exclamation point on several persistent Chinese problems like pollution and overpopulation.

Try this and see what you learn... start a yeast culture in a jar full of sugar water. The yeast will happily reproduce consuming sugar and excreting alcohol. Unless you're talkin' Sam Adam's Ninja Yeast somewhere between 10% and 14% alcohol all the yeast die.

Now... how big is the jar? Is it the Asian continent or the whole freakin' planet?

No worries, the survivors will start a big ol' Utopian nudist colony in Enn Zed!!