How would you out Sunn Model T the Model T?

[Nickerz]

So I recently got into doom metal and I'm specialized completely wrong. I spent a good amount of my guitar life learning all the ins and outs of guitar tone for thrash. Now I'm interested in getting into the scene but I've noticed all these amps while they have enormous thunderous bass, don't have real balls or definition. It's like having a 5" truck exhaust vs sports car exhaust.

I'm trying to understand how to move things forward in the age of B,A,F,G tunings. Can someone help explain to a nube how these massive transformer amps do their thing?

Obviously these are unintended uses here. So how do you move this concept forward? How would you make something with the grunt of the Model T, but the balls and definition of a hotrod JCM? Has anyone made a 200w JCM and just scaled up tubes and transformers? And when you do that, how do you "scale up" preamp gain?

[Stevem]

Please take this just how I am posting it!

If you where playing anything I could concider music I would take the time to help you!

Pick up a Acoustic guitar and learn how to sound great on that!

[Masco]

There was a cat in my old neighborhood named WINO who is supposedly The Godfather of “doom”. He played model T’s, but I never really was crazy about his sound. I was more into his music and the whole scene. AND I definitely wouldn’t put it in the category of “non music”. In fact, it was some of my favorite music when I was in my late teens(~40 years ago).

[thetragichero]

the name of the game is obscure amp fetishism
i'm only half kidding....

also popular in this style are the old orange/matamp heads. big 68nf coupling caps throughout - more bass than I'd probably want even in a bass amp lol
model t - ultralinear power stage running 4x6550. BIG LOUD clean power. that's about it besides clc before the first supply node
fender twins are loved in this style, not as coveted, but basically if i can slam it with fuzz pedals that does the sounds
huge love for old solid state, sunn and peavey and (to a lesser extent) acoustic. i love this part. personally i dig slamming my acoustic 140 with a fuzz for a real gnarly bass tone

to be honest there's a lot more cache in graphics and name recognition than any sort of technical wizardry in building

[Nickerz]

the name of the game is obscure amp fetishism
i'm only half kidding....

also popular in this style are the old orange/matamp heads. big 68nf coupling caps throughout - more bass than I'd probably want even in a bass amp lol
model t - ultralinear power stage running 4x6550. BIG LOUD clean power. that's about it besides clc before the first supply node
fender twins are loved in this style, not as coveted, but basically if i can slam it with fuzz pedals that does the sounds
huge love for old solid state, sunn and peavey and (to a lesser extent) acoustic. i love this part. personally i dig slamming my acoustic 140 with a fuzz for a real gnarly bass tone

to be honest there's a lot more cache in graphics and name recognition than any sort of technical wizardry in building

So we're on the same page, that's why I'm here.

1. Amp fetishes - Agree
2. Clean headroom - Agree

The other two points beget their own questions.

3. Ultralinear : What if any tonal advantages or differences are present here? At least one local amp tech thinks that when they saturate they have a different tonal quality to them. Otherwise why not just use something like a 200w per side Strategy poweramp?
4. Fuzz : What makes a preamp "fuzz friendly?"
5. Fuzz^2 : What makes fuzz the preferred distortion style in lower register music?

Because so far it would make more sense in this case to just use a Mesa Strategy with a Fender preamp.

Reason why I'm here, and not anywhere else is to answer some of the hard questions. e.g. Is UltraLinear amp fetish, or is it different in this application?

[thetragichero]

a lot of folks don't like the sound of a fuzz into an amp with a bright cap on the gain/volume because of how brittle some of those high frequency fuzz artifacts sound when the highs are that accentuated
apparently dudes like the sound of low frequency pummeling fuzz transistors. i don't know why... i try to tune no lower than dadgad and my basses are all tuned to standard... i get low frequency ooomph from eq in my fuzz

i can't tell you theoretically or empirically about how the ultralinear output section sounds vs standard ab but my next (or next next) build is matamp/orange-inspired preamp with ltp into basically a bassman 135 output section (thanks to a forum member selling me the transformer). current build is basically the same preamp into a 50w output section

edit: what i found really odd after researching the old old matamp/oranges was the cathodyne phase inverter into cathode biased output stage. seems the opposite of what I'd assume to be a "metal amp" but i guess my default goes to Marshall/jcm800/tight thrash type amp as well

[KivettBednar]

Personally, I'm extremely glad that you asked this question. I'm a huge Doom fan myself. And I'd love to see the Model T circuit focused more towards what its modern purpose has turned out to be. I wish I could help with the technicals more. I know Sunn used Heyboer trannies, so that would be a good place to start.

I hope this thread gets picked up again.