Anyone ever use a Peltier cooler to chill a warm PT?
Don't holler at me; I just thought it was a neat idea. Not sure how you get the heat out of the cabinet, though. Or whether Peltier coolers make electrical noise.
Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
Moderators: pompeiisneaks, Colossal
-
The New Steve H
- Posts: 1047
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 11:24 pm
Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
Relax. It's SUPPOSED to smoke a little.
-
gingertube
- Posts: 531
- Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 2:29 am
- Location: Adelaide, South Oz
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
I've used peltiers for laser cooling, for temperature tuning of a narrow optical passband band (0.6nm wide) filters, and tempearature (and hence wavelength) control of laser diode arrays in the day job. I did the peltier driver and control circuit designs, so I guess I can claim to know a bit about them.
Where are you going to get the power to run the peltier? Another Transformer and rectifier?
Peltiers really are very inefficient heat pumps. Also you will find that (when cooling) you want to run them at around 30% of their maximum current rating, otherwise you end up just pumping (mostly) the heat from their own current squared times resistance power dissipation. That means - if you want to pump say 30 Watts of heat you need a 100W rated peltier cell.
My own view is that you are better off with a fan. You don't need huge airflow just a little assist for the convection cooling - rectify a 6.3V heater supply for around 7 to 8V and wire a 12V fan to it. Fan will run slow and quiet but effectively. You may be better off with a mains powered fan so as to not further load the power tranny - it is a trade off between addition tranny load vs improved cooling.
Thermal management is often one of those last 10% things which sets the great designs apart from the less great. VERY good to se that you are thinking about this "up front".
Cheers,
Ian
Where are you going to get the power to run the peltier? Another Transformer and rectifier?
Peltiers really are very inefficient heat pumps. Also you will find that (when cooling) you want to run them at around 30% of their maximum current rating, otherwise you end up just pumping (mostly) the heat from their own current squared times resistance power dissipation. That means - if you want to pump say 30 Watts of heat you need a 100W rated peltier cell.
My own view is that you are better off with a fan. You don't need huge airflow just a little assist for the convection cooling - rectify a 6.3V heater supply for around 7 to 8V and wire a 12V fan to it. Fan will run slow and quiet but effectively. You may be better off with a mains powered fan so as to not further load the power tranny - it is a trade off between addition tranny load vs improved cooling.
Thermal management is often one of those last 10% things which sets the great designs apart from the less great. VERY good to se that you are thinking about this "up front".
Cheers,
Ian
-
Paultergeist
- Posts: 189
- Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2006 5:18 pm
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
My small bit of real-world experience using Peltier cooling devices comes from use of some small Polymerase-Chain Reaction (PCR) devices. These are used extensively in the bio-tech industry, and these things have gotten really small and compact......which sounds perfect for cooling a transformer......except.......most of these devices - at least all of the ones I have seen - needed a fan to shunt the heat away from their own heat sink. In other words -- and I am just guessing here -- Option A might be to use a Peltier (which would almost certainly require a fan), while Option B would be to ONLY use a fan -- all assuming your amp is putting off enough heat to require it. Something to consider....
-
The New Steve H
- Posts: 1047
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 11:24 pm
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
Gingertube, back in the 90s I used to build temperature and current controllers for diode lasers. I was an assistant for a physicist who was trying to find ways to cram more information into an optical fiber. I wonder if you had anything to do with the circuit we copied.
When I went to graduate school, he stiffed me on the work I did! I hope someone else beat him to the patents he was looking for.
When I went to graduate school, he stiffed me on the work I did! I hope someone else beat him to the patents he was looking for.
Relax. It's SUPPOSED to smoke a little.
-
The New Steve H
- Posts: 1047
- Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 11:24 pm
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
Oh, and I'm not thinking about it up front. I built the amp and found out I was really pushing it, current-wise!
The real answer is to cut it up and put a bigger transformer in it, but I hate to mess up my nice machining.
The real answer is to cut it up and put a bigger transformer in it, but I hate to mess up my nice machining.
Relax. It's SUPPOSED to smoke a little.
-
gingertube
- Posts: 531
- Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 2:29 am
- Location: Adelaide, South Oz
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
Stuff I did on this back in the 90's was for Oz Navy System and a US Navy Research Lab System so I doubt any of it was published anywhere for anyone to "rip off".
Quote:
"When I went to graduate school, he stiffed me on the work I did! I hope someone else beat him to the patents he was looking for."
Unfortunately, not an uncommon story. These "sods" eventually get found out and reap the approriate rewards.
John Lennon:
" Time wounds all heels"
Cheers,
Ian
Quote:
"When I went to graduate school, he stiffed me on the work I did! I hope someone else beat him to the patents he was looking for."
Unfortunately, not an uncommon story. These "sods" eventually get found out and reap the approriate rewards.
John Lennon:
" Time wounds all heels"
Cheers,
Ian
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
I remember guys using Peltier coolers on computer CPU's in order to overclock them way higher than the stock configuration.
The problem they had was that condensation would form on the cooler and drip water down on to the motherboard.
Some industrious chaps would run a bead of silicone caulk around the processor to seal it against moisture.
But most abandoned this practice and went with water cooling with a closed system.
If it were me, I would get a quiet 120mm fan and run it in the head case.
I know Sunn used to use fans and a few other amps as well.
You see them especially on some bass amps since those suck a lot of current.
The problem they had was that condensation would form on the cooler and drip water down on to the motherboard.
Some industrious chaps would run a bead of silicone caulk around the processor to seal it against moisture.
But most abandoned this practice and went with water cooling with a closed system.
If it were me, I would get a quiet 120mm fan and run it in the head case.
I know Sunn used to use fans and a few other amps as well.
You see them especially on some bass amps since those suck a lot of current.
Tom
Don't let that smoke out!
Don't let that smoke out!
Re: Peltier Cooler to Chill Transformer?
I've also programmed a couple peltier devices...UI, PID, etc. A cheap fan is a simpler solution.