good schematic / PCB design software

[Omicron]

I'm looking for some decent schematic / PCB design software, without spending a small fortune.

I've downloaded TinyCAD and FreePCB, and started fooling with it this morning. Anybody have experience with these tools?

I'm definitely looking for schematics & PCB layout. Auto-routing is nice, and SPICE simulation is nice.

It doesn't have to be free, but I really don't want to pay more than $200. Rather put the cash towards tubes and transformers

Thanks in advance for your advice!

[DonMoose]

I like KiCAD

http://kicad.sourceforge.net/wiki/Main_Page

Free, reasonably easy to use, large community of users.

[selloutrr]

FreePCB I found to be limiting.

You are limited to small design dimensions. It works for FX pedals.
The program wont let you export the file. It's intended to be used to mass produce via the company. All troubleshooting is looked over by an employee and billed back to you without corrections only a pass fail.

try
Eazydraw for Mac OSX (http://www.eazydraw.com/)

[husky]

I'm looking for some decent schematic / PCB design software, without spending a small fortune.

I've downloaded TinyCAD and FreePCB, and started fooling with it this morning. Anybody have experience with these tools?

I'm definitely looking for schematics & PCB layout. Auto-routing is nice, and SPICE simulation is nice.

It doesn't have to be free, but I really don't want to pay more than $200. Rather put the cash towards tubes and transformers

Thanks in advance for your advice!

PC, mac or linux? Eagle- cadsoftusa.com
http://www.cadsoftusa.com/downloads/fre ... anguage=en

[Omicron]

I use a Windows PC. Eagle only does those tiny little boards for free, after that it gets real expensive real quick.

[davent]

I make my own boards and have used ExpressPCB for years, it's free and real easy to learn. http://www.expresspcb.com/

There's a big library of tube related custom components available at the Hoffman forum. http://www.el34world.com/Forum/index.php?topic=590.0

If you need to farm out the actual board production you are limited to their inhouse production so you'd be better off with another software that produces Gerber files allowing to shop your job around for best deals/options. (I have seen it said there is an Asian company that will take the ExpressPCB file but can't confirm it.)

dave

[husky]

I use a Windows PC. Eagle only does those tiny little boards for free, after that it gets real expensive real quick.

6"x4" is like $50
Excellent program though and far cheaper than the other professional alternatives

[Cliff Schecht]

I started using Eagle when I started at PAiA (about when 5.0 came out). There's sort of a learning curve but IMHO this is some of the best schematic capture/layout software available, especially for our level of usage (simple 1-2 layer boards). Once you get good with Eagle the time from starting schematic capture to finishing most layouts will be less than a day, more typically only a few hours. Once you use it for a while you'll build up a nice library of parts that have been confirmed good which also speeds up your work dramatically. It takes some practice making boards and screwing up little details before you get it right, but this is true of any layout software. For this it helps to know how the manufacturing process works.

Also I use a lot of the little downloadable scripts available from Eagle's website. They give you stuff like database management (make quick BOM's and such), missed connection zooming tools, automatic parts placement tools, heck the list goes on and on. There's also a lot of downloadable libraries which I have had great success with - it seems the CadSoft guys actually check out the models before they post them online.

Many professionals and big companies use Eagle now, it's not quite industry standard but like at TI there were many groups who used this software to do all of their boards. I've done everything from single layer boards to six layer boards in Eagle (it can do like 16 layers I think) using anything from 0201 resistors to inductors that can handle many amps of current. I've done medical circuits, RF stuff and pretty much anything audio/tube related with Eagle and it works beautifully, especially once you learn the quirks of the interface.

FWIW I used to use Protel 99 and then moved onto Altium Designer, both great and very powerful (too much so really for our needs) packages that are bloody expensive. These also do simulations which I loved; one software package that does everything right is rare! I've also used Orcad (blech!) for stuff but find that program is miserable to use and refuse to use it now if I have a choice. I still use Eagle for layout but for simulations I now use NI's Multisim. This program has the most models built in of any program I've ever seen, and they all work. They also have simulated real-time equipment (function gens, spec analyzer, oscope, DMM, etc..) that you can adjust while you run a simulation (like working with real equipment). It's pretty accurate this way or you can do the more common setup-->click run-->view results type sims with a bit more accuracy. I've designed some crazy circuits using Multisim's help including a piece of medical test equipment with 140dB of gain over a few kHz bandwidth (was looking at nV level signals from the brain!).

[Kagliostro]

Give a look to Eagle

I don't use it but a friend of mine do and say it is very good

Kagliostro

[VacuumVoodoo]

A word of warning regarding Eagle (which I have been using since 2004).
Always check component PCB footprints in Eagle libraries against original datasheets, especially for switches etc, they're not always correct.
I recommend learning to make your own components library early on, you'll need it.

[vibratoking]

Cliff I agree with most of what you said. But, I use Orcad and find it to be a very good program. It does capture, layout, has a good footprint lib, auto routing, forward and backward annotation, pspice sims. Pretty much everything. I'm not sure what you percieve as the problem. It is very expensive, but it does ALOT. I paid nothing for my copy. All that being said, I would use Eagle if I had to pay for it, but I would not have nearly the functionality that I would prefer to have.

[DonMoose]

Always check component PCB footprints in Eagle libraries against original datasheets, especially for switches etc, they're not always correct.
I recommend learning to make your own components library early on, you'll need it.

This advice applies - in spades - to any layout package. Assume that switch and connector footprints that come with the software are for parts you can't buy anywhere.

[husky]

A word of warning regarding Eagle (which I have been using since 2004).
Always check component PCB footprints in Eagle libraries against original datasheets, especially for switches etc, they're not always correct.
I recommend learning to make your own components library early on, you'll need it.

Agreed but it is a mistake not to check all libraries in any program.
I never use the libraries supplied by any program but use them as a foundation and copy the parts in to your own libraries.

My arm can also be twisted if you send me Eagle files since I have a PCB router, I can do double sided or single sided PCB's Usually much cheaper than a board house if you only need a few, you need eyelets for thru holes though, if my time allows.
This was done on my router with my MITS router, We have done surface mount parts as well, I just need .009" between traces with my standard cutter. I even use this machine to cut pearl inlays for guitars

I wouldn't assume Eagle is really missing anything, I used to use Protel and I am not wanting if fact get things done much quicker in Eagle, Eagle has come a LONG way in the past 5 years and the price is tough to beat. Bruce Egnater actually turned me on to Eagle. I used to use Douglas Cad Cam (I turned Soldano on to that and he still uses it) and then Protel. My only warning about Eagle. MAKE sure you always have the schematic and layout open or you will break connectivity. Another thing I love about Eagle, no backwards or forwards anything. Everything is always connected. Delete something on the schematic and it is gone from the board.

[VacuumVoodoo]

John, is that board made with your CNC router? - very cool indeed.
When you open a schematic in Eagle it asks if you want to open its board layout too. It has some minor quirks but on the whole it's great tool for yours truly who has been doing 15"x15" 4 layer boards on a light table with Bishop Graphics tapes ages ago...

[husky]

John, is that board made with your CNC router? - very cool indeed.
When you open a schematic in Eagle it asks if you want to open its board layout too. It has some minor quirks but on the whole it's great tool for yours truly who has been doing 15"x15" 4 layer boards on a light table with Bishop Graphics tapes ages ago...

Yeah the problem is if you accidentally close the layout and continue working in the schematic you get a mess.

Sweet! We would have a lot of fun talking I'm sure
Yes I cut this on the MITS machine. I had to step the file over though since my limit is about 15" and this was 18" long
I'm very happy with it except for the price. It has made designing very satisfying though. What I did here is peel the copper with a heat gun since I dont like ground planes for tube audio in most places.
Eliminated Prototypes and made custom projects fun.
It just runs while I do other work. No tape etc, just Gerber out of Eagle in to their software.

It seems like I learn something new everyday I cant believe I didn't know in Eagle. It reminds me of Rhino3D that way.
For instance in the layout just type the designator and the part flys to the viewable window. I also like the ability to now save which layers are on and off in presets