Metroamps EFX Loop in 2204 - how to install?

[cruisemates]

I have a Marshall 4010 (combo version of 2204).

I just purchased the Metroamps zero-loss effects loop - and took it and my 4010 combo to a qualified amp tech. Unfortunately, he says the included instructions (which are for the metroamps kits) are not specific enough for the 2204.

He is asking me if there are more specific instructions on how to install the zero-loss loop into a 2204? Does anyone have a schematic, picture, or just some plain advice on how to install this?

I appreciate all help (and yes, I tried the search function).

[funkmeblue]

I believe this is the same fx loop mojotone sells. Mojo has instructions http://www.mojotone.com/amp-parts/amp-k ... Amplifiers

[Colossal]

I am a bit concerned with your tech's skills. Metro FX loops can be installed in almost any amp, especially Marshalls, not just Metro amps. The CDrom documentation included with the loop is perfectly sufficient to install the loop in a 2204. The loop goes between the wiper of the treble pot and input to the master volume pot. B+ to supply the loop board is tapped off the phase inverter B+ supply and dropped down with the supplied power resistors. The choice of power resistor depends on your amp's PI B+ voltage.

[cruisemates]

I figured someone would say that about my tech. I honestly don't know. He is very well-established and well-liked in these parts - has been running a successful amp repair business for over 30 years.

I am just assuming he wants everything to be 100% and does not want to take any chances.

If he read your comment, I am pretty sure he would have a good answer to explain his concern. But thanks for the answers - and anything else anyone wants to add.

[ToneMerc]

He is asking me if there are more specific instructions on how to install the zero-loss loop into a 2204? Does anyone have a schematic, picture, or just some plain advice on how to install this?

I don't know what instructions he already has, but it's pretty straight forward.

TM

[Colossal]

I figured someone would say that about my tech. I honestly don't know. He is very well-established and well-liked in these parts - has been running a successful amp repair business for over 30 years.

I am just assuming he wants everything to be 100% and does not want to take any chances.

If he read your comment, I am pretty sure he would have a good answer to explain his concern. But thanks for the answers - and anything else anyone wants to add.

I wasn't trying to be derisive with my comment. The instructions are very straightforward. If he is unfamiliar with it, I can understand the reservation.

[Structo]

Perhaps he doesn't feel comfortable with something he hasn't done before or doesn't want to invest the amount of time necessary to get the voltages right and the loop working good.

I used to hang out a lot at Metro when I wanted to build a Super Lead and everybody that tried that loop loved it.
And there were some guys that didn't know that much that with a little guidance were able to install it and get it going.

So maybe a different tech is in order.

Or better yet, do it yourself, it isn't that hard and we're here to answer questions.
For free I might add.

[cruisemates]

Point taken - I would find it hard to believe he could be the most well-known tech in our area for so many years and that he would not know how to read those instructions - but I won't deny that it's possible

If I find out anything more, I will let you know. Maybe we need a new tech in this neighborhood, but I sure don't know any.

[quick]

This layout and instructions were sent to me by the loop's designer a couple of years ago. Hope it helps.

[cruisemates]

The tech told me the CD he got with the loop package would not load in his computer. I don't know - but we emailed him the right PDFs thanks to you all and we'll see.

There is nothing I would love more than to hang out with you amp builders all day. But I barely know how to use a volt meter and I know there's something called Ohm's law but I've never applied for the badge.

I love "tinkering" but I am a real novice. I can barely build one of those radio shack "75 projects in one box" devices.

I am pretty good at talking the language, though, and probably could do it with a little hands on instruction if I had the time.

[NickC]

Point taken - I would find it hard to believe he could be the most well-known tech in our area for so many years and that he would not know how to read those instructions - but I won't deny that it's possible

If I find out anything more, I will let you know. Maybe we need a new tech in this neighborhood, but I sure don't know any.

I don't know the specific situation with your tech. But I will relate an experience I had with the local, "go-to", "well respected" tech here. Took the amp in suspecting it needed a power supply recap. Weeks went by without a word. So I called and got the "been busy" reply and a promise it would be ready in a week. Two weeks go by and no phone call .... been a month by then. I'd have done it myself but was pressed for time and was willing to pay to get it done quick. Got the "need more time" excuse. Two months later I drop by the shop. Tech says he couldn't find anything wrong with the amp. Charged me a $75 bench charge. Took the amp home, thoroughly pissed .... plugged it in and it made the same horrible noises it had before taking it in. Took it right back to the shop an hour later. Plugged it in there and demonstrated the problem. He says it never did that the whole time he had it and that I must have "bad karma". I left immediately before temper got the best of me. That was an expensive lesson in the local "go-to", "well respected" tech. True story.

[crbowman]

Point taken - I would find it hard to believe he could be the most well-known tech in our area for so many years and that he would not know how to read those instructions - but I won't deny that it's possible

If I find out anything more, I will let you know. Maybe we need a new tech in this neighborhood, but I sure don't know any.

I don't know the specific situation with your tech. But I will relate an experience I had with the local, "go-to", "well respected" tech here. Took the amp in suspecting it needed a power supply recap. Weeks went by without a word. So I called and got the "been busy" reply and a promise it would be ready in a week. Two weeks go by and no phone call .... been a month by then. I'd have done it myself but was pressed for time and was willing to pay to get it done quick. Got the "need more time" excuse. Two months later I drop by the shop. Tech says he couldn't find anything wrong with the amp. Charged me a $75 bench charge. Took the amp home, thoroughly pissed .... plugged it in and it made the same horrible noises it had before taking it in. Took it right back to the shop an hour later. Plugged it in there and demonstrated the problem. He says it never did that the whole time he had it and that I must have "bad karma". I left immediately before temper got the best of me. That was an expensive lesson in the local "go-to", "well respected" tech. True story.

About 20 years ago I had a similar experience. Had an amp go down, took it to the guy who at the time was the local "go-to" guy here in Austin.
Won't mention the guys name, as much as I'd like to (not Jon. He was great!). Asked me when I'd need it, I told him two weeks, and he says 'oh, no problem. I'll have it done tomorrow or the next day'. A week passes and I start getting excuses. Two weeks pass, I call him and he says 'yeah...I'm not going to be able to get it done today.' I go get it, take it across the street to a lesser known tech who fixes it while I wait for $40. Pissed me off so much that I vowed to learn how to work on 'em myself. So I guess I should actually kinda thank the guy............Nah.

[Structo]

Unfortunately I think a lot of amp techs are like auto mechanics.
There are good ones and bad ones.

What I hate is poor communication and excuses for not having it done by the date he said it will be done.

I do some tech work mostly for fun in my town and I always feel guilty charging for my work.
I feel justified charging for the parts for sure but for my time I probably don't charge enough.

But something that has always been true, if you don't charge enough people will think there is something wrong with you.

I had a guitar I made and I needed some cash so I took it to a store to sell it for me.
He asked me how much I wanted for it and I said oh, I don't know, I have about $600 into it.
So he marks it $650 and the guitar literally sits there for two months.

I go back and he says, just for shits and giggles lets price it at $1,100.

It sold the next day.....

Finding a honest tech is worth his weight in gold.
I hate those expensive bench fees but I do understand that their time has value.

Used to be a place in my town that fixed all kinds of electronics.
I had an old Akai receiver that didn't work.
They charge $25 to diagnose it and if you want them to fix it , they apply the $25 towards the labor.
That place is long gone.

But the place that rips people off every chance they get is still in business.
And I know they have a poor reputation.
Go figure.

[Reeltarded]

Funny thing to me is that all the "qualified" amp repairmen I meet read it on the internet.

Funny when I point out to these morons that they read the wrong forum.

I worry though. I have seen many "add a KT88 to my Champ" threads lately. Big influx last month. We should save a copy of this place while you can still wade through it.

[cruisemates]

FWIW: I just got my 2205 back from this same tech (not the project with the loop I started out talking about) and it sounds like the heavens opened up.

He said all it needed was some caps replaced, and new tube sockets.
He said my mid-range tone stack was virtually dead. Total cost $160 and I have never loved this amp so much.

I do think the guy knows what he is doing - and is just humble and not a bull-shifter about what he doesn't know. He probably just asked me to get him better instructions so he would have to charge me for the time it would take him to seek and acquire them.

My faith is restored.