Thiele 1x12 with EV and built in two mic’s tone comparison

[ericlee]

Hi,
Here are some pics and sound samples of my Thiele cab with built in two mics ad EV.
[img:500:473]http://www.guitarampcab.com/lmcab2.jpg[/img]
I’ve recorded both mics simultaneously on different channels, no EQ, no reverb.
On the first (mono) clip off axis samples are followed by the same phrase with an on axis mic.
http://www.guitarampcab.com/ottest2.mp3
On the second (stereo) clip on and off axis mics are paned 50% left and right.
http://www.guitarampcab.com/ottest1.mp3

Guitar is a Strat with Kinman’s (neck, middle) and Kent Armstrong’s motherbuker bridge pickups. Amp is an OTS 100 with my mods and mercury transformers, choke.
Please let me know your thoughts.
Cheers
[img:900:758]http://www.guitarampcab.com/lmcab.jpg[/img]

[LPSGME]

The OD and clean both sound absolutely great.

Are the mods, dare I say it, a secret?:roll:

[Structo]

Sounds good to me!

[Drumslinger]

very nice indeed ericlee. same capsules or different?

[Bob-I]

The clean tones are fantastic, the OD is good, but not over the top fantastic.

I like the concept of having the mikes mounted like that. What are the capsules?

[jrittvo]

A novice's question... Wouldn't you want to mic one of the ports also? And mix it with the driver mic?

[guitardude57]

No, you mic the speaker.

[Bob-I]

A novice's question... Wouldn't you want to mic one of the ports also? And mix it with the driver mic?

The port is mostly to let the speaker breathe, but the real low end thump comes from there as well. Mike it and you'll hear no tone at all, just thump.

Mike the cone, if you cover the holes you'll hear a difference because of restriction on the cone.





How do I know this...?? I tried it when I was a newbee.

[selloutrr]

A novice's question... Wouldn't you want to mic one of the ports also? And mix it with the driver mic?

You wouldn't generally mic the port of a speaker cab because of the air moving in and out. You hear the woosh as much if not more then the tone. in some cabinets the presure can be enough to bottom out the diaghram of the capsule inside the microphone.

It's generally best to mic the speaker just off axis of the cone to prevent piercing high end and capture the body of the signal.

with that said.. there is no absolute right or wrong if it works for your needs and you like the way it sounds it's correct.

Keep in mind there is nothing EQ will fix you can't fix with microphone placement and sellection. EQing causes phase shifts.

[bluesfendermanblues]

Keep in mind there is nothing EQ will fix you can't fix with microphone placement and sellection. EQing causes phase shifts.

Fully in agreement with your views on mic placement, but in a DAW based recording system, you don't nessesarily get the EQ related phase issues, that you used to get with analog EQs.

I have several phase liniar EQ plugins....eg from (plugin manufacturer) Waves. They are labelled 'Phase liniar'. Also the EQs in Cubase work great in that respect.

However, as you said its much easier to get the right sound at source, instead of spending hours trying to EQ and compress to get usable sounds.

[ericlee]

Thanks everyone for checking this out, let me answer your questions.

The OD and clean both sound absolutely great.

Are the mods, dare I say it, a secret?:roll:

No secrets! circuit is almost similar to RF’s amp which was described by Brandon in his latest post. Differences are:
LNFB on V1B 22M in series, 440pf, 22M.
68k slope resistor on V1 instead of 150k.
No FET circuit. Instead of PAB relay operates clean volume increase, regulated by additional 470k linear pot. Gives me much better and flexible boost on both channels without changing the tone.
Permanent 56pf bright cap on volume pot.
550pf cap on deep switch instead of 390pf.
Jazz setting is removed, amp is always on rock. Jazz/rock switch bypasses OD trimmer on rock, so I have much more drive if needed.
V2A snubber is 220pf and V2B is 330pf.
Presence pot is 2,5k and cap is 3,3mf.
Overdrive RATIO input resistor is 100k instead of 180k and the cap is 0,01mf which I can increase to 0,02 or 0,03 with the three way mini switch in BRIGHT hall (bright function is canceled).
Also three way mini switch on MASTER pot with 44pf and 88pf bright cap. Mid position is off.
Finaly I have 12 way rotary switch with 220pf, 330pf, 440pf, ………..and 2200pf as a OD treble bleed filter which does not reduce mids when RC filter does.

very nice indeed ericlee. same capsules or different?

Thank you sir. Both capsules are identical.

The clean tones are fantastic, the OD is good, but not over the top fantastic.
I like the concept of having the mikes mounted like that. What are the capsules?

I’m working on drive . capsules are very light, neodymium instrument mic inserts, similar to zen 609.

Here is a live band video of clean and drive tones, hope you enjoy it.
Cheers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kh6qtVQAs4U

[Bob-I]

Here is a live band video of clean and drive tones, hope you enjoy it.
Cheers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kh6qtVQAs4U

Wow, that sounds like a different amp to me. That's near perfect IMHO.

[Structo]

OK, so you are Dr. Ika?

I thought I recognized that speaker cab and mic setup.

On the video, your tone sounds fine but we're always for that last 5% aren't we?

Keep up the good work!

[selloutrr]

Keep in mind there is nothing EQ will fix you can't fix with microphone placement and sellection. EQing causes phase shifts.

Fully in agreement with your views on mic placement, but in a DAW based recording system, you don't nessesarily get the EQ related phase issues, that you used to get with analog EQs.

I have several phase liniar EQ plugins....eg from (plugin manufacturer) Waves. They are labelled 'Phase liniar'. Also the EQs in Cubase work great in that respect.

However, as you said its much easier to get the right sound at source, instead of spending hours trying to EQ and compress to get usable sounds.

Even the "linear EQ plugins" have an effect on the phase they just use compensation algorithms to mask it.

[ericlee]

OK, so you are Dr. Ika?
I thought I recognized that speaker cab and mic setup.
On the video, your tone sounds fine but we're always for that last 5% aren't we?
Keep up the good work!

Shell we say last 2,5% , 12 way filter was on 660pf, I’ll put it on 330pf next time, .
Regards.