any interest in Dumbleator II info?

[Funkalicousgroove]

Pics of the DLATOR II are in the files section if anyone is interested in the OP.

[mat]

Pics of the DLATOR II are in the files section if anyone is interested in the OP.

Thanks Funk! Really appreciate

[ampdork]

Cool. I wrote a long reply asking you to also edit your accusations that are false against me but I only found myself back into a deep debating mode and I haven't the time for it.

I will say this one last bit since you saw fit to only remove the nasty names and not the false accusations.

My chassis, should it bear any resemblance to yours, is borne out of the fact that you and I reversed the same mans chassis design....Dumbles.
I never asked you for anything and my work was done with my own eyes and hands along with a little help from Photoshop and CoCreate...

I have never ever EVER started ANY builder bashing threads on tgp EVER.
The worst I have ever said was about Alan of CA's one amp that sported some blue goo. This was a mistake on my pasrt because I thought it was a homebrew amp and therefore open for criticisms. I do believe Alan and I have resolved that long ago and I do not think there any grudges about it.
Otherwise the only other threads i have been vocal in were tags and not one single time ever did I say anything bad or down on ANY other amp builder. I may have boasted about my amps tone...big deal. It sounds great and not one person had anything negative to ever say about it.
So again man that was wrong. If anyone here needs scrutiny about builder bashing methink you are a great candidate. You have bashed me, Carrol-Ann, ceriatone, TR, and many others I am sure, numerous times as well.
Again not trying to stir the pot again. This is old hat now.

I do think you have done plenty of chest pounding and king of the mountain pushing around of others that I think you may be partly to blame for less input from other builders here.

In fact what about the HRM board guy. He was a builder and was also making great layouts for this group. He got ran off because I think he asked you about how to do an HRM after he bought one of your chassis..

Just sayin' that maybe if you would yourself tone down on the builder bashing maybe it would help the group you love so much.
Your not the only person getting inside of these amps you know...maybe stop shutting the door on that fact and hang a little looser.

For the record too I was never ntending to "slag" you. Indeed I find pirates and bootlegger and capitalists to usually be great company and far more interesting then accountants...

Carry on. Like Joe said I too wish all in ampdom or even just dumbledom all the very best this life has to offer. It is too short and soon enough will all of this not matter in the least. It doesn't even matter now in fact.

Back to paths of lesser resistance...

[Funkalicousgroove]

In fact what about the HRM board guy. He was a builder and was also making great layouts for this group. He got ran off because I think he asked you about how to do an HRM after he bought one of your chassis..

FYI, that was BNWITT, Scroll back a couple pages, he's here, in this very discussion. He wanted pics of an amp I was building, I didn't get them to him by when I said I would, we were both right, and both wrong, but we're cool now.

So I guess that wasn't my last post on the matter

[Tonegurus]

Yeah, those Jackoff's called me wanting to buy my transformers, I'm willing to bet that if you open an EL1 it looks VERY CLOSE to the how-to tutorial I posted in the files section last December. $2500-LOL!!!!!!!

They originally put my cabinet guy (we used to use the same guy)together to call me and ask because they were too chickenshit, they wanted to buy whole kits!

I actually agreed to sell them a few trannies, because they called me up with some story that they weren't going to go into production, and they only wanted to build 5 or so for really good customers, well that whole deal went sour, and I told Bill to go F#@% himself.

I will build one for $500 for any two-rock owner to keep them from buying that ridiculously priced TR unit!

I appreciate the administrator keeping this thread open. I think you may have missed the fact that the insulting comments began with Brandon, unless "chickenshit", "jackoffs", and " didn't have the balls" don't count. I must have missed that in the forum rules. "Capitalist" and "bootlegging pirate" getting a response of "piece of shit, go fuck yourself" is ok, too, I guess. Regardless, I'm only here to post my side of the story, as for some reason there appears to be a major misunderstanding. Yes, we contacted Brandon for some power trannies, as we have had requests for a stand-alone buffered loop from more than a few folks over the last 3 years. We hadn't planned to build more than a handful, and we've been cobbling some together (5 or so per year) from surplus stuff since we began 10 years ago. You were kind enough to offer us 5 trannies. A few weeks later, it was looking like 2-3 more weeks, and at that point we had laid the groundwork for a nice chassis and decided to order our own trannies rather than wait, or inconvenience you, for that matter. You imply(or someone else may have suggested) that we stuck with you parts you ordered for us, which is not true. We are happy to take them off your hands, as you did order them for us and we feel obligated to do so. You did, however, tell us to fuck off, so I assume that means you'd rather keep them and be angry. That is your right. As far as pirating cirrcuits, layouts, etc- Bill and Mike Bendo at Mesa were installing buffered loops in Fenders and Boogies 28 years ago for Kimock, among others. Not sure what you were doing then. In any case, like everyone else in ampdom, we wish you continued success, and I hope we can have a phone conversation at some point and clear the air. Life is too short, man.
Thanks,

Joe
K&M

Dear Sir,
The facts of the matter is, that the number of posts, you've posted on this forum, could indicate, that you are merely here to gather info rather than sharing. In fact you've only answered two posts, this current one, and one regarding the TwoRock John Mayer Sig.

He posted here in reaction to the post made about he and his company, here. Then the caustic post got cross posted by a zealot to another, more widely read forum. Whether TR contributes to this forum is immaterial in this regard. He's here to clear their name.

BTW, I think Brandon is a great guy who has helped me out personally in the past, and the TR guys are cool too - and I sincerely don't believe they look to this forum other than to see how the DIY community is coming along in their discoveries. I know that Bill thinks that general knowledge here has grown a lot in the past couple of years, and he doesn't feel at all threatened by it. They have their own designs, etc. and the world is big enough for everyone. Two-Rock continues to grow as a company even though the principles were just as happy running it at the size it was a couple of years ago.

I think there may be a little bunker mentality here that doesn't need to be there. It rears its ugly head here from time to time. FWIW, I'm a "hair club" member here, still working on my soldering skills so I can build this damn kit I have here, LOL!

[Funkalicousgroove]

Honestly, I could care less about having 5 $35 trannies around, they'll get used, what irked me about that incident is when they called me I initially said no, because it didn't benefit me in any way to sell them my transformers- then Bill ASSURED me that he had no intention of going into production on these, and only wanted to build 5 or so for some really good customers. I suggested he simply refer those 5 folks to me and I'd take excellent care of them, He insisted that "My people want TR stuff, just like your people want Bludotone stuff" so I agreed, he said he'd call me back. He called me back a day or so later(might have been later that day, don't remember) and said he wanted 5, I said I'd have to order them, they usually take a couple weeks, I ordered the next day, and was told that they would be an extra couple weeks, I called Bill Immediately and said that they were going to take longer, and he said that was fine and he still wanted them. They arrived a few weeks later, and I called Bill to let him know they were in, his response was "Oh, I bought a hundred in the time it took you to get me those" Dumbfounded, I said "why? I thought you weren't going into production on these" his response was "well I just kinda said that cause.." I said " I know why you said it, go (insert expletive)"

So, here's why I was upset about that interaction:

1) I initially said no, Bill assured me that they weren't going into production, so I agreed to sell him a few. as evidenced by their website they did in-fact go into production, and I can assume they intended to all along. The ONLY reason I agreed to sell them a few was because Bill ASSURED me they weren't going into production on these, and wanted to service a few good customers as stated.

2) I told him they were going to take a bit longer than usual, he wanted to continue with the order. If the time frame was any kind of issue they knew right away that they were going to take a while, Joe tries to make it sound like it was some kind of surprize- Seems to me that if they weren't going to take them, that phone call would have been the time to say so.

I feel I was lied to, "Put together" as we used to say in retail many moons ago, and I don't care for that. there is nothing Bill or Joe could say over the phone to justify that- But mostly I was upset because I answered correctly the first time when I said no, then second guessed my better judgement, but I did learn my lesson

[phsyconoodler]

Being a sort of bystander here,I too have taken advantage of the amp design for my own line of amps.However,mine are not direct clones.I make them different enough to not call them clones.
But,that being said,we all are using the man's designs for our own profit and we should all just back off calling anyone out on this.
The only claim funk and ampdork have over the rest of us is their work on reverse engineering.
We also need to remember Leo Fender used Western Electric circuits for his amps and Marshall used the Fender Bassman as his first amp design.
We are all guilty of using other's ideas and designs.
I am quite surprised how some of you make them look so much like mr. dumble's that many can't tell the difference.
It's like building an exact copy of a Fender Super Reverb.No one says much about that at all.
As long as there isn't a patent infringement involved and no legal woes to speak of,we all continue to do it.
Ceriatone is no different.If he sees a profit in it with no repercussions,he's on it like Oprah on a baked ham.
You guys wanna fight?Go outside!

[dogears]

Whoops!! Sorry Mike. I meant to repsond to yoru post but deleted it by accident. So sorry bro... I am new as a mod and had butter fingers.....

[dogears]

Since I really do feel bad about screwing up Toneguru's post, I'll try and adequately explain what he was saying.

He pointed out that the new Two Rock models really are optimized for use with the loop. Especially the killer Type 2. Several of the good TR customers requested loops. TRs motivations were not in any way anything other than honorable. I do believe him fwiw. They have been building loops for years and with the surge in sales of the Types 1,2, and 3 a loop product seemed to be a good idea. That is the basis of it all.

If I remember correctly, he pointed out that Bill has had nice words for Brandon's work, and I can add that there have been some real glowing praises of the Type 2 and Type 3 by people Brandon and I know.

Mike, as a very new mod (1 day!), I assure you I practice no agenda or grudges here. It was truly an accident that I deleted the post. As a mod, there is no special login or extra step to do mod stuff. If I click the worng button, poof.... No warning. So I learned a lesson and need to be more careful!!

[Tonegurus]

Thanks Scott, that was the essence of it. I was the catalyst for the whole thing, but I had no part of approaching Brandon for the transformers. Bill did NOT want to produce these things, and resisted it for over a year. Joe made a (correct in my view) product marketing decision to produce them because they had models that were incomplete without them.

Maybe they should have told Brandon when that decision came down, but the decision didn't impact Brandon at all relative to his 5 transformers so they didn't think of it at the time. Again, they had nothing to gain by taking advantage of Brandon and I can't see how he comes to the conclusion that he was or would have been taken advantage of here. Plus, Bill turned Kimock onto Brandon just recently.

So I would hope that the conspiracy stories that get cross posted by certain sycophants and mean spirited slagging of Two-Rock here would stop. It's not what this forum is supposed to be about anyhow, right?

Mike

[talbany]

Sorry Guy's But I have to jump in here... Brandon accused me of not contributing to the to the Forum as well.. Right after posting gut shots of an amp that went to Lou Toomey of Books and Dunn!!! as well as the Layout to the amp.. THATS!! NOT!! CONTRIBUTING!!! Really is it me!!!
As well as posting clips of an amp from another Nashville heavy..and giving credit to a mod Gill posted (4 Resistors) for the amp and thanking him.... Brandon had the guts to imply that I should give Gill some money for the Mods.. No offense Brandon but that is none of your business.. If it was a mod I credited you for that's a different.. You have nothing to do with my relationship with Gill or anyone else here on this forum..



Tony VVT

[ayan]

Sorry Guy's But I have to jump in here... Brandon accused me of not contributing to the to the Forum as well.. Right after posting gut shots of an amp that went to Lou Toomey of Books and Dunn!!! as well as the Layout to the amp.. THATS!! NOT!! CONTRIBUTING!!! Really is it me!!!
As well as posting clips of an amp from another Nashville heavy..and giving credit to a mod Gill posted (4 Resistors) for the amp and thanking him Brandon had the guts to imply that I should give Gill some money for the Mods.. No offence Brandon but that is none of your business.. If it was a mod I credited you for that's a different.. You have nothing to do with my relationship with Gill or anyone else her on this forum..

Tony VVT

You owe me nothing, Tony -- but don't understimate the power of 4 resistors (and I don't even remember what that was about). Really, we are totally cool and really, I am not sure what the mod was.

I was given the goods by two friends, a long time ago, and in turn shared just about everything I had learned over the years. Of every single person I have shared with -- and that includes the entire internet (first alt.guitar.amps, then ampage.org, and later this forum), as well as several amp building companies -- I have gotten back from a few folks, and you guys know who you are. Brandon happens to at the top of that short list, enough said. Others' posture on the sharing philosophy is diametrically opposed to Brandon's, which is less than inspiring to me.

Gil

[Tonegurus]

Hi Gil! Still have the Music Man. Thanks again for that one!

Mike

[dogears]

Ok guys.... Let's all cool down. I think the points have been made here.

I think the issue is if you take a penny, give a penny. Whatever that may be. If you have nothing to give, that is fine too. But, don't slag those that do. Try to be a additive force here.

As for Brandon, there is not a single person here who has shared more inside knowledge. That deserves a little respect IMO. Brandon has also already apologized for losing his cool a bit. Cut the man some slack before this place loses its single most contributing member.

Lastly try to keep TR bashing out of here. TR makes good products and has a certain marketing scheme they follow. That is their business and if you don't like it, don't buy it.

Everybody shake hands and let's move on.

Mod hat off.....

[talbany]

First off I want to say is I hold no grunges here..I had a customer come in last week who was at the Amp Show in Jersey and was looking for a dead on Dumble type amp I referred him to Brandon.. Brandon if you want his name I'll be glad to PM it to you..I think he was a Berringer Rep..
But to all the DIY's out there thinking they can start there own amp company with just the material posted here.. You are in for a long hard road my friends..
The time it takes to build these amps and the cost..... (especially if your buying parts in small quantities) if you want to stay competitive makes this an extremely difficult market to break into.. If you don't have any connections or already have a brand name established it's virtually impossible...Those builders out there who just do clone style amps Dumble and Twrecks only enjoy it while it last's because when it ends and it will end..It's back to doing repairs..So DIY'ers out there who think they can take the info posted here and start a sucessfull amp company... Better think again
Oh and also if you plan on making a great Dumble style amp.. I hope you are also a KILLER!!! player and have a golden ear as well as know a great deal about electronics, PCB design.. Auto Cad etc..Web Design etc.. I have a Bachelors in Music theory and Classical Guitar training from George Mason as well as 30 or so years in clubs and bars.. over 2,000 gigs under me... My partner designs underwater weapons systems for the Navy(Rocket Scientist) and was a head engineer at Hughes Comm for years and even we are surprised at how difficult this market is...
I am not discouraging anyone from staking there claim just.. Be aware it's not as easy as what some people here might lead you to believe...
There's my Nickel's worth...


Tony VVT



Tony VVT Amps