EVM-12L Classic Reissue vs G-1265 or original EVM-12L

[Bob-I]

Seems that for every 3db you get twice the volume for the same wattage. While I'm not sure about that exactly,

I for one don't believe that you can quantify volume as "twice as loud", any more than you can call something twice as red, or twice as hot, or twice as Bob. Since our ears make corrections for volume, similar to the way our eyes make corrections for brightness it's all subjective.

That said I agree that gigging with low power amps requires higher efficency in the speakers. Personally I like lower powered amps for gigging as you can get the power tubes pushed to the edge of breakup and get a nice juicy tone.

My 2 main gigging amps are a 50 watt Peavey converted to Dumble in a 2x12 combo Emi Tonker and Swamp Thang, or a 33 watt Dumble into a Thiele with an Emi Delto-Pro. They're about the same volume at the same settings.

Cool report, I'll be interested in more info as the EVM breaks in more.

[doveman]

I for one don't believe that you can quantify volume as "twice as loud", any more than you can call something twice as red, or twice as hot, or twice as Bob. Since our ears make corrections for volume, similar to the way our eyes make corrections for brightness it's all subjective.

I know what you mean but it kind of makes sense to me. If I had to go get an amp that would have given me this volume, I think it would have been 50w-60w rather than the 33w. So it was a really nice suprise and I began to wonder why.

[doveman]

Well I ordered a EVM12L Classic from American Music Supply.
We shall see. I'll have to pair it with one of the speakers I have on hand.

So ... noticed you got your EVM12L ... how's it working out?

[Structo]

I like it a lot Ken.
Seemed to tighten up the bottom end and to really suit the amp.

I also added a 100K resistor to the input of the PI ahead of the .02uf cap.

Haven't had a chance to give it a real workout at volume yet, to be fair to the wife, but I think it is going to work out great.

Thanks to Butwhatif for the suggestion of the resistor.
I also changed back to a 270pf treble cap and have all bypass caps at 5uf now.

[doveman]

I was finally able to play I live gig last night with the EVM12L reissue. The amp sounded great and was reportedly too loud. I had to back off a bit on the volume ... which was nice after struggling with keeping up with band volumes during rehearsal.

If fits really well with an OD amp like the D'Lite. I was pleased.

[greiswig]

I bought a used EVM-12L and a Sholz Sugarcone that is still breaking in. This was to experiment against the G1265 that I already have. Greener grass and all that...

Initial impressions:

The G1265 Reissue reminds me of an SM-57: it works well for a lot of different things, and is a good "core" sound. It's just a great all-around speaker for this style of amp from what I can tell. I like it a lot. At higher volumes, the bass tends to not come through as cleanly as I'd like, but it also develops its own brand of compression that is nice in a lot of ways.

The EVM-12L reminds me of a good condenser mic: it doesn't work on everything, but for the things that it works well on (clean tones in particular) it works really well. But I kept coming back to the G1265, which sounds a little more user-friendly to my ears. The EV is a little like playing with a camera close-up on your right hand: everyone is going to hear every little mistake.

The Sugarcone...the jury is still out on that one until I break it in some more. So far, it reminds me of a really good ribbon mic: smoother mids and high-mids, less high-end extension than the EV but more than the Celestion. But it is also more revealing of pick attack than the Celestion. It seems to be more consistent than the Celestion from low volume to high, similar to the EV. Very nice, and the smoothness of it almost makes it sound like you've turned down the OD trimmer when you switched from the G1265. There's less snarl to the tone, but maybe snarl is what you want.

HTH someone,

[odourboy]

I've got the EMV12L, the G12-65 and the Sugarcone as well. I love your analogies! As you've no doubt noticed, the Scholtz takes a LONG time to break in - I'd give it at least 30 hours before even beginning to pass judgement. Initially, I was really taken with the Scholtz. But over time, I found it had a character flaw that started to annoy me.. it was a sort of hi-fi, 2 dimensional thing that turned me off. I've still got the EVM 12L and the Celestion, but the Sugarcone has fallen out of favor with me and it's back in it's box.

I'd love to hear how this plays out for you so please keep us posted.

[greiswig]

(SNIP)Initially, I was really taken with the Scholtz. But over time, I found it had a character flaw that started to annoy me.. it was a sort of hi-fi, 2 dimensional thing that turned me off.

odourboy, I'd love to hear a bit more about this. But I don't want to co-opt the thread. Elsewhere, I've seen exactly the opposite description ("very 3-D"), but I confess to not understanding what any of that means, or how I would listen for it. It's really hard to describe sound, I know, but it'd be great if you could give it a go.

[Bob-I]

I've never heard of the Sugarcone. Even google only finds reference to forums.

Tell me more.

[greiswig]

I've never heard of the Sugarcone. Even google only finds reference to forums.

Tell me more.

Hi, Bob,

Tom (EDIT: George...I always have trouble with that name) Scholz Sugarcone, aka Harry Joyce's speaker of choice. Most of the references I could find to it were on gearpage. Some people love it. Dogears seems to not care for it all that much, although it was unclear from his posts whether the one he had was sufficiently broken in or not.

[Bob-I]

I've never heard of the Sugarcone. Even google only finds reference to forums.

Tell me more.

Hi, Bob,

Tom Scholz Sugarcone, aka Harry Joyce's speaker of choice. Most of the references I could find to it were on gearpage. Some people love it. Dogears seems to not care for it all that much, although it was unclear from his posts whether the one he had was sufficiently broken in or not.

Actually I found this http://www.earcandycabs.com/

It's George Scholz, not Tom Scholtz which explains why I didn't find it on google. He claims that they're broken in before shipping them.

The cabs look very cool but truthfully I haven't found anything I like better than my 2 favorites, the Peavey 2x12 combo with Emi Tonker and Swamp Thang and the Steel Sound 2x12 with Warehouse V30 and G12H copies. The Thiele with a Delta Pro is a close second, and I have a reconed EVM12L coming so we'll see.

[odourboy]

(SNIP)Initially, I was really taken with the Scholtz. But over time, I found it had a character flaw that started to annoy me.. it was a sort of hi-fi, 2 dimensional thing that turned me off.

odourboy, I'd love to hear a bit more about this. But I don't want to co-opt the thread. Elsewhere, I've seen exactly the opposite description ("very 3-D"), but I confess to not understanding what any of that means, or how I would listen for it. It's really hard to describe sound, I know, but it'd be great if you could give it a go.

First, I must apologize for spelling 'Scholz' wrong - wouldn't exactly help Bob or anyone else in their web searches.

The sound - I know why it is described as 3D by many - it has a hi-fi quality that seems very detailed. There's nothing objectionable about the spectrum - seemed very well balanced with no grating edge, boom or ice-pick (I used it in both an oval open back oversized 1X12 an a TL806 and it worked well for me in both). You may REALLY love the speaker. Like I said, my initial reaction was really positive.

The reason I said '2-D' (and maybe that was a bad choice) is that after a time, I found the Hi-Fi, detailed imaging as sort of unnatural or 'fake' sounding. I have to admit, it's hard to articulate. And don't get me wrong, I still think it's a very good speaker. I've had many that are not as good. But after a while I just lost interest in it, stopped using it and eventually, took it out of the cabinet to make room for something else (a Celestion G12 Century Neo FWIW).

Brian

[greiswig]

The reason I said '2-D' (and maybe that was a bad choice) is that after a time, I found the Hi-Fi, detailed imaging as sort of unnatural or 'fake' sounding. I have to admit, it's hard to articulate. And don't get me wrong, I still think it's a very good speaker. I've had many that are not as good. But after a while I just lost interest in it, stopped using it and eventually, took it out of the cabinet to make room for something else (a Celestion G12 Century Neo FWIW).

Brian

Brian,

I think I follow you. I can't classify this as my experience at this point, I noticed something before I knew the Sugarcone was broken in. Resorting to analogy again, I have a friend who tours with a Rainsong guitar, in spite of the fact that he has the best Olson acoustic I've ever heard. And, as Rainsongs go, it's a good one. You could describe the sound as "accurate" insofar as it responds very evenly and predictably to what you do with it. But if you play a decent wooden acoustic next to it, you realize that half the magic of a really good acoustic guitar is those little imperfections...the peaks and valleys in its response.

That's kind of what I noticed when I first fired it up: it is less clinical than the EV to my ears (which is too clinical for what I want), but it lacks some of the character that I really like in the Celestion G12-65.

I'm still breaking it in, though, and want to give it a fair shake before I pass final judgment. Meanwhile, and again hoping that we're contributing to this thread and not co-opting it, I'd love to hear more about your Century speaker and where it fits in.

Best,

[Structo]

I found this the other day when I looked it up.

Q. How many do you guys have made per run?
A. ZERO, these are hand made one at a time and NOT in runs.

Q. Are the SugarCone's Broken in when I get my cab?
A. They are broken in and tested after being made. We then test and break them in further at our facility after installation in your cab. So, yes, they are semi broken in when you receive them but still have a little time left on them for physical break in.

Q. What is the difference between the "SugarCone" and The Scholz speaker in the Harry Joyce® Issued cabinets?
A. The Current issue of the George Scholz speaker has been altered in 2 ways. 1. The S is printed on the Dust cap in Gold and 2. The Gaskets for the EarCandy OEM Scholz SugarCones are made for front loading as all of our cabinet's are front loaded.

[Structo]

Any of you guys try the Ear Candy 2x12 cabs?


Here is a pretty cool video from them.
They blow up a 10" speaker, it actually catches on fire after 4:00.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?http://www ... cle_id=223