Can someone compare relative difficulty of

[sgrass]

Can someone compare relative difficulty of a Twreck build as compared to, say a P1 which so many people have started out on?

Also, the interview with ken Fischer reported on elsewhere is really interesting, and a great contribution.

It does open up a lot of lines of thought, and it implies, I would suggest, that Ken's ideas have application to anyone who build's amps.

I can think of any number of layouts to Fischerize.

[Chris G]

Hi,
To answer your question,The wreck circut itself is not that different,there is just more of it...ie tubes,sockets,knobs.....the power supply will be different......I guess it would depend on your own ability......and remember if you get in a jam,you can always find help here!!!!
thanks!!
Chris

[LeftyStrat]

One thing you should consider is your experience level. If you've never done any electronics before, maybe start with some pedals or the Ax84 P1, simply because you need to develop some soldering and troubleshooting skills.

The main thing is that if you have problems with hum or squeal on a P1, you have less to debug. Another consideration is that on Ax84 from time to time I see someone just starting out and blowing a transformer because they wired up something wrong. Better to lose a cheaper Hammond transformer rather than more expensive iron for a wreck.

I've been building electronics for years, but mostly synth and guitar fx. I started with the P1Exteme from AX84, and then built a Matchless Spitfire for my daughter. Then retrofitted a ptp board on a 74 Marshall for a friend. Now I'm working on a JTM45. When it is finished, I know I'll be ready to tackle a 'wreck.

It is possible for you to start with a wreck if you feel you have the skill and patience. But be sure to use this startup guide for first powerup:

http://www.paulrubyamps.com/info.html#FirstPowerUp

Also make sure you understand the lethal voltages present and the safety procedures to follow.

[sgrass]

paul,

I have read you instructions several times and appreciate your having all that on your site.

I am starting with the P1, and it is a challenge for me as my ability to decode the jargon, understand the schems and troble shoot are limited.

It is fun, adn I do appreciate the warnings about safety, which I think are so important to keep everyone safe.

I am thinking that my second build may be another P1, or the almost identical (?) HO, but with an eye to using the types of components that Fisher talks about, high quality, etc. while at the same time fine tuning my wiring and soldering skills.

I love the komet sounds from Ken's current amps, and I also am totally wowed by Nyberg's JTM-45 (http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~ehn/ax84/#jtm45) byt for now I plan to perfect my ability to build the simpler plans to a decently high standard.

I have a lot to learn, and even the basics of electronics are new to me. (I am lucky to recall the essential workbench skills from my youth when my dad built heathkits.)

Its lots of fun, and interesting to try and learn all the new stuff.

Thanks for the input.

Steve

[LeftyStrat]

paul,

I have read you instructions several times and appreciate your having all that on your site.

I'm not Paul, just someone who has learned a lot from his posts and the info on his site.

I am starting with the P1, and it is a challenge for me as my ability to decode the jargon, understand the schems and troble shoot are limited.

You may want to pick up something like "Electronic Projects for Musicians" by Craig Anderton. It has a good section on reading schematics. I think it is an important skill for debugging. A friend of mine purchased a PTP board for his Marshall online, and he couldn't get the thing working. He brought the amp over and I found a couple of mistakes, fixed those, and still the amp didn't work. So I pull up a schematic and realized the wiring diagram sent with the product was wrong.

I love the komet sounds from Ken's current amps, and I also am totally wowed by Nyberg's JTM-45 (http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/~ehn/ax84/#jtm45) byt for now I plan to perfect my ability to build the simpler plans to a decently high standard.

Yeah, Eric's clip of the JTM-45 is why I have one almost complete on my bench right now.

My P1ex was a rats nest, but it worked. I had a few hum problems with my Matchless Spitfire clone until I elevated the heaters. It was kind of messy because I built it into an Electar 30 and didn't plan things as well as I should have. But my JTM-45 I'm being very neat and taking my time with. Of course, all of it looks sloppy compared to this:

http://mhuss.com/php/pix.php?p=DR508_guts

[neatpete]

A wreck is not a good first build. When Ken comes along and says that its pretty much a hybrid between an oscillator and an amplifier then you know you've got your work cut out. I can build most amps now and have them work first powerup, but this is after two years of building and about twenty projects (most rebuilds on previous ones), and having tried my hand at a wreck I will say that I don't think its a very good first project unless you are either already very good with electronics, are willing to spend lots and lots of time reading, and also have bags and bags of enthusiasm otherwise you'll never finish the thing. Sounds harsh, but even something like a P1 can be tricky for a first timer to get right, so going to a big push pull amp with a high gain preamp smacks to me of biting off more than you can chew.

Not to say that it won't work of course, but the odds really are against you, theres a huge amount to know to really get these things to work. Its great fun when they do, but can be crushing when they don't, especially if you've spent a lot of money and end up destroying something

peter

[sgrass]

I'd say both you guys are dead on, from my limited beginner's experience.

Right now the "simple" P1 is proving to be quite challenging.

I think the thing that would be interesting to try out is to use very high quality (with out going NASA, of course) parts for pots, caps, & etc. and see if these parts ended up helping out the tone.

Thanks for all the input.

Steve

[neatpete]

Start with cheap parts. This is my golden rule for comparing any parts that are claimed to be better. I find the cheapest stuff I can, then swap out one at a time for a different part. There's no point in starting with super duper wonderful stuff, because you won't know the difference that you're paying for. Most of the time the cheap and nasties sound better to me when used in the right combinations and locations.

peter

[neilium]

Start with cheap parts. This is my golden rule for comparing any parts that are claimed to be better. I find the cheapest stuff I can, then swap out one at a time for a different part. There's no point in starting with super duper wonderful stuff, because you won't know the difference that you're paying for. Most of the time the cheap and nasties sound better to me when used in the right combinations and locations.

peter

Sage advice. I would add, though, you might want to spend a little extra on the parts you'll be interacting with on a regular basis: switches, jacks, and poteniometers. Good ones cost maybe a little more and last a lot longer. They make the difference between wanting to work on your amp (fun) and needing to work on your amp (aggravating).

[neatpete]

Good point. Alpha pots and Carling switches are good places to start, they're good without being too expensive, and will most likely serve you well for many many epochs to come